G4 rebate for G3 owners...??

[Razmo]

Guys,

Is there a planned rebate for G3 owners who purchase G4? Also, do they intend to rerelease a new Tx with a throttle hold switch for us Heli guys??

Thanks
Raz

[phrank]

According to the announcements Yes to the Rebate.

Helis however, hmmm....
Fumbled Throttle hold location on controller.
An update already to fix the 3 pos switch?

tsk tsk.
Someone needs a heli pilot on their staff.... :eek:

My cash is slowly creeping back into my wallet.

[Blade Scraper]

According to the announcements Yes to the Rebate.

Helis however, hmmm....
Fumbled Throttle hold location on controller.
An update already to fix the 3 pos switch?

tsk tsk.
Someone needs a heli pilot on their staff.... :eek:

My cash is slowly creeping back into my wallet.
What is rebate?

[phrank]

What is rebate?
Google.

Or Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rebate_%28marketing%29)

[Zelatio]

Google.

Or Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rebate_%28marketing%29)


Ouch.

phrank: Actually he meant how much is the rebate. And yes I know that you probably understand that. Still funny :).

Blade: He meant that because he read the announcements, he knew there was a rebate, we just do not know how much it will be yet. I'm hoping for at least $100.

[jeffpn]

No way in H-E-double hockey sticks willl it be a $100 rebate. I'm betting $30 at the most with an expansion pack. I knew I should not have bought them all.

[phrank]

Kind of hard to ignore an open door. ;)

Ouch.

phrank: Actually he meant how much is the rebate. And yes I know that you probably understand that. Still funny :).

Blade: He meant that because he read the announcements, he knew there was a rebate, we just do not know how much it will be yet. I'm hoping for at least $100.

[Blade Scraper]

Ouch.

phrank: Actually he meant how much is the rebate. And yes I know that you probably understand that. Still funny :).

Blade: He meant that because he read the announcements, he knew there was a rebate, we just do not know how much it will be yet. I'm hoping for at least $100.
I just didn't know what rebate was. Wan't asking how much.

[crashed again]

What is rebate?
when you put another worm on the hook i think.
maybe i am wrong. :D

[Razmo]

KE, could we atleast get a date on the rebate details?

Raz

[Adam Taylor]

KE, could we atleast get a date on the rebate details?

Raz

Rest assured; we will post this information when we receive it.

[arb6591]

Blade Scraper wrote:I just didn't know what rebate was. Wan't asking how much.
What's Wan't ? :D English is my second language, please help :D
All right, all right Reggie :) just kidding, I know it was a typo but we need some humor here to balance some very serious entries, no offense intended ...

Andrzej

[SilverEagle2]

Question is, if I buy today, will I still be eligable for the rebate?

I sure hope so. Although I had a $30.00 discount from Tower. Add free shipping on that and I think I did OK.

[Razmo]

Question is, if I buy today, will I still be eligable for the rebate?

I sure hope so. Although I had a $30.00 discount from Tower. Add free shipping on that and I think I did OK.

Adam,

Would you mind answering this one? This is pretty much what I meant to ask.

Thanks,
Raz

[Adam Taylor]

Question is, if I buy today, will I still be eligable for the rebate?

Yes, you can purchase G3.5 now and still be eligible for the G4 rebate.

[SilverEagle2]

What I meant to ask is....

If I buy G4 today as a G3.5 owner, will I still be eligable for the rebate when it is announced on the copy of G4 I bought prior to the rebate announcement?

What I did not want to do is wait for the rebate announcement only to not be able to get a copy because stock of G4 was backordered so bad from the publisher.

Jason

[jeffpn]

I think he said 'yes.'

[SilverEagle2]

I think he said 'yes.'

No, he said that if I bought G3.5 I would still be eligable for the G4 rebate.

I just bought a copy of G4 to get ahead of the rush but still want to get the rebate because I am a current G3.5 owner.

Two very different scenarios and he answered one but not the other.

Jason

[Adam Taylor]

Ahhhh, yes. I misunderstood.

At any rate, yes, you can buy G4 today and still be eligible for the rebate providing you already own G3.5.

[SilverEagle2]

Beautiful!!!

[jeffpn]

I think he said 'yes.'
:D :D :D

[3D-Seth]

But still, even if it is only $30 isnt that better than nothing?

my .02

Seth

[rjmanzuk]

But still, even if it is only $30 isnt that better than nothing?
my .02
SethSure ... in fact, it's the price of one no-longer useful add-on. I have 5 of them.

[Razmo]

Yes, you can purchase G3.5 now and still be eligible for the G4 rebate.

Adam,

I meant if I buy G4 now am I elgible for the rebate when it's annouced. I suppose you are saying that I am. Is that right? I am a G3 owner.

Thanks,
Nick

[SilverEagle2]

The answer has been posted to that one now as well.

Yes! :D

[mahbouni]

I bought G3 and updated it to G3.5 online. If I buy G4 can I get a rebate and how much will it be? How would I receive my rebate, considering I'm in the UK? Our currency is £ not $.

[lesliehowell]

:( I sure do hope it is enough to make up for the cost of 3.5 that is only about 11 months old and then there is all the expansion packs. I have all of them!

[jeffpn]

The expansion packs are compatible; addons are not

[opjose]

:( I sure do hope it is enough to make up for the cost of 3.5 that is only about 11 months old and then there is all the expansion packs. I have all of them!

Highly unlikely.

Your expansion packs are NOT "out of date" as you CAN use them in G4, so scratch that off.

I'd be surprised and happy if we see more than an 50.00 rebate...

So I take the 50.00 rebate combined with the 30.00 discount I got at Tower on G4, and I'm in the neighborhood of 120.00 for the upgrade with the controller.

IMHO not bad at all.

[phrank]

$30 discount? :eek:
Please sir, do tell.....
I may dump my LHS in favor of this. ;)

[opjose]

If you go to Tower Hobbie's web site right on the front page it says $25.00 off your $199.00 order...

Since I signed up for the "club" ( cough )... I was able to use:

"
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Special Savings for Members Only
Save $30.00 Instantly Off Your $199 Order
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Order today and save $30.00. Place at least a $199 order and for a limited time we'll take $30.00 off the total. All you have to do to claim your savings is click on ad number 011T7 and it will be placed in your shopping cart. This special offer is not retroactive. Please, only one promotional ad number per order.
"
That may or may not work for you...

Add to that free shipping and the rebate...

Frankly the "club" is no great shakes, but the ( rather low at times ) discounts do help.

[phrank]

Thank You kind sir!

[0xdeadbeef]

I'm still a little concerned how the rebate will be handled. Will the tooth fairy put a dollar bill below my pillow?
Also: if the rebate will be given without sacrificing the Interlink, how will they prevent people from selling their G3 after getting the rebate? And how will they cope with people who bought G3 from someone who already claimed the rebate?
Then again, if the Interlink has to be sent in to get the rebate, this would be kinda useless for international customers due to high shipping costs. Also it would be probably more profitable to sell G3 instead.
Are there any G2 veterans who can tell us how the rebate for G3 worked?

[pplace]

Just my opinion or (thinking)

I would assume that they will announce when the rebate is available and then:

If it deals with sending the G3.5 Interlink in:
1. You send it in with your name, address information etc. and get the rebate

If you are able to keep the interlink (which I hope):
1. You might need to send in both your "original" invoices from where you purchased G4 and G3 ??
2. Possibly will even need to send in the "original" UPC label from the box (G3 and G4)?? To show you still have them.
3. Along with your name, address information etc.
4. Then the rebate will be sent to you

This way it shows that you did indeed purchase G3 and also G4?

BUT:

I assume the rebate will only be available for the "original buyer" of the software. (hence needing the original invoices....and or UPC labels??)

Again that is only MY thinking (as you did ask.....and this is ONLY a discussion about this particular topic)

I for one hope you will not need to "forfeit" your G3.5 interlink. If so the rebate would have to be rather steep for me to give it up. (As I plan to install G3.5 at work)

But of course I could be 100% wrong about all of it.....the only way we'll know, is when they make the official announcement

[Zelatio]

They would never make you send in the Interlink. That is just plain stupid. I'm betting on UPC's from both packages. Proves you own both, and is easy.

[0xdeadbeef]

How would the UPC code tell them that you actually own it? The code is the same on all packages, so an infinite number of people could claim the rebate. Doesn't sound like a good idea to me. If at all, the rebate would be based on the Interlink/G3 serial number since it's unique. So if someone gets the rebate and sells G3 on eBay, the lucky buyer won't be able to get the rebate since the rebate for that interlink would already be given.

[Zelatio]

How would the UPC code tell them that you actually own it? The code is the same on all packages, so an infinite number of people could claim the rebate. Doesn't sound like a good idea to me. If at all, the rebate would be based on the Interlink/G3 serial number since it's unique. So if someone gets the rebate and sells G3 on eBay, the lucky buyer won't be able to get the rebate since the rebate for that interlink would already be given.

A cut out UPC is how all rebates work. There is no reason to fix something that isn't broken. A serial is a good idea. And of course if you registered your copy of G3 they have your name and all that jazz already. They should just give out rebates to those who prove they have G4 with a serial and UPC and already have their names registered as a G3 owner. To those that made up fake names and whatnot, sucks for you.

[phrank]

I too would like to know how the Rebate from G2 to G3 owners was handled.

Most will not keep the original packaging, or the receipt even. Some LHS that I've been to do not have the product that was purchased printed, only a dollar amount, or the line item "miscellaneous RC" written.

Then only reason I would see for Great Planes requiring return of the Interlink, is if you bought the software at a "Discounted" upgrade price. I wouldn't give up my original Interlink for $30 or $50 rebate unless it was substantially higher.

[Zelatio]

Even for $50, I would never send in my Interlink. Just suck it up and pay the normal price I'd say. If the Interlink "Elite" or whatever happens to break, it can still act as a dongle and be able to transmit for the old Interlink.

[mahbouni]

I have to say that this is vague and not very encouraging to existing customers. I have no idea if I can get a rebate or how it will be paid to me. I work in the software industry and things are usually much more sensible than this. You either buy a full product or an upgrade, which requires a license key from a previous version. If I can get a decent rebate then I'll upgrade now, but if not not then maybe I'll just wait for the next version to make the upgrade more worthwhile. Maybe a better product from another brand will be available by that time.

[Johndou]

Jim Bourke has stated numerous times that there will be a rebate - the details of which will be announced soon.

Speculating about how it's going to work, how much it will be, etc. can be rather confusing to other people reading these posts.

[whitewolf]

www.realflight.com/promos/rf-g4-rebate-form.pdf

[Johndou]

www.realflight.com/promos/rf-g4-rebate-form.pdf

That's hilarious!! "If you purchased ... on or after May 1, 2007..." :D

Current customers of RealFlight G3.5 will receive a rebate toward a purchase of RealFlight G4. Our publisher, Great Planes, will announce pricing and the rebate details shortly.]

What happened to the "Current customers" Jim? :confused:

[0xdeadbeef]

"Offer good only for items purchased in and by residents of the USA and Canada."

That kinda sucks for folks like me who paid much more for G3 anyway since they live in another part of the world and now don't even get the rebate.

[opjose]

What happened to the "Current customers" Jim? :confused:

Check the BOTTOM of the rebate certificate.

"Current" customers and/or those w/o the receipt get $75.00 in merchandise or $30.00 cash.

I'll take the merchandise, combine it with the $30.00 discount from Tower, and effectively the upgrade is costing me $95.00.

That $75.00 is going against a new O.S. engine purchase... not bad.

And of course I keep my G3.5 version too.

I'm a happy camper.

A bit better than I had thought!

[jbourke]

It's a pretty generous rebate...

Take someone who bought G3.5 in May of 2007.

He plays with it for a year and buys G4 in April of 2008.

He gets a $100 merchandise certificate.
And he sells G3.5 on ebay for $100.

So G4 is practically a free update for him.

Jim

[0xdeadbeef]

Then again, no rebate at all for all customers outside North America is not so generous after all.

I can understand that shipping dollar bills to the end of the world is kinda expensive, but there would have been other ways. E.g. free download + serial of the first G4 expansion pack (or one of the G3.5 EPs).

[jbourke]

Then again, no rebate at all for all customers outside North America is not so generous after all.

Please take this up at your point of sale. I know how the distribution works here in the US but that is the extent of my knowledge. I have no idea if rebates are going to be offered elsewhere or what sort of factors enter into that sort of decision where you live. International pricing gets very complicated due to the number of times the units change hands, shipping costs, etc. You may be able to address this with your local hobby store or distributor.

Jim

[Johndou]

Check the BOTTOM of the rebate certificate.

"Current" customers and/or those w/o the receipt get $75.00 in merchandise or $30.00 cash.

I'll take the merchandise, combine it with the $30.00 discount from Tower, and effectively the upgrade is costing me $95.00.

That $75.00 is going against a new O.S. engine purchase... not bad.

And of course I keep my G3.5 version too.

I'm a happy camper.

A bit better than I had thought!


Umm, okay, I feel like and idiot ... Sorry I missed it. I read it and it just went right threw this pea little brain of mine ... I apologize - profusely!

Jim is absolutely correct that is a VERY generous offer!!

[0xdeadbeef]

Please take this up at your point of sale. I know how the distribution works here in the US but that is the extent of my knowledge. I have no idea if rebates are going to be offered elsewhere or what sort of factors enter into that sort of decision where you live. International pricing gets very complicated due to the number of times the units change hands, shipping costs, etc. You may be able to address this with your local hobby store or distributor.

Jim

The rebate excludes people from outside North America no matter if they bought G3 in the US or not. So the argument is not really conclusive in my humble opinion.
Also I'd assume that KE/GP earns the same money for each copy, no matter if the copy is sold inside or outside the US and no matter how much more people outside the US have to pay due to additional middlemen.
Be sure that the distributor and local dealer would refer me to GP/KE if they'd respond at all.

[opjose]

Jim is absolutely correct that is a VERY generous offer!!

Wow, I find myself agreeing with many of your posts of late.

I must get an exam now. :D

[p.delorenzo]

As mostly every International Customer I agree with 0xdeadbeef.

I bought RF G3.5, the 5 Add-Ons, the 4 Expansion Packs AND RF G4, all after may 2007, from Tower Hobbies but... I'm a French Customer living in France!

But what? I'm a customer no?

How can they take my ugly international cash, from me, an ugly international customer, and cannot help me with the rebate as every nice North American customers with their nice rebate?

[opjose]

As mostly every International Customer I agree with 0xdeadbeef.

I bought RF G3.5, the 5 Add-Ons, the 4 Expansion Packs AND RF G4, all after may 2007, from Tower Hobbies but... I'm a French Customer living in France!

But what? I'm a customer no?

How can they take my ugly international cash, from me, an ugly international customer, and cannot help me with the rebate as every nice North American customers with their nice rebate?

It would be interesting to see if Tower will honor the Merchandise credit for you against a future purchase of covered hardware.

I would hope so, since you would be basically ordering from "with in" the U.S.

[Johndou]

Wow, I find myself agreeing with many of your posts of late.

I must get an exam now. :D


Yea? Well it's about time you came around to my way of thinking. :eek:


;)


Seriously - with that rebate and Tower's prices and discounts - it might be too much for even me NOT to get G4.


Did I really say that? :confused:

[pplace]

<-------This dummie had ordered G4 from Tower too early......the next day I received the e-mail from tower with the "discount" off the $199.00 orders!! I wouldn't expect my life to go any different!!haha

I told my wife I should cancel my order and re-order it. Then decided against it when I saw "limited quanities available" in 10-15 year's I'll have forgotten about that $25-30 I missed out on!haha

[0xdeadbeef]

It would be interesting to see if Tower will honor the Merchandise credit for you against a future purchase of covered hardware.
I would hope so, since you would be basically ordering from "with in" the U.S.
While this is academic for most international customers anyway who bought outside the US, the rebate form is quite clear about "only residents of the US and Canada" getting the rebate.

[opjose]

While this is academic for most international customers anyway who bought outside the US, the rebate form is quite clear about "only residents of the US and Canada" getting the rebate.

True, but if you ordered G3 direcly through Tower how will they view the sale?

[r1derbike]

Oh man...where did I put that receipt...where did I put that receipt?

AAAUUUGGGHHH! It's in the attic along with dozens of boxes from the move almost two years ago! AAAUUUGGGHHHH!

I MUST peruse Tower to see if the invoice is still in purchase history....AAAUUUGGGHHH! :eek:

Charles

[r1derbike]

WooHoo! Found the box and UPC proof of purchase!

Looks like the 75.00 Merchandise credit is now doable!

This is generous. Very.

Thank you Great Planes/KE, and anyone else I've neglected to mention!

Now...if I could just switch-out the G4 goodies when they arrive, and put my G3 stuff in the G4 box, and tell my wife her gift she purchased for me arrived from UPS, and she better wrap it for the holiday, before I open it! Then I'll act really surprised when I open it!

Oh man! This is gonna work!

Charles

[r1derbike]

Ox, I feel for ya' buddy. I ordered some motorcycle gear from the UK, and they had a special discount for UK customers only, but I went ahead and got it anyway.

I remember feeling a bit chuffed about it, but decided the trip to the island would be far too costly to take matters into my own hands...

I hope you explore all the possibilities! Good luck!

Charles

[Norton]

Ox, I feel for ya' buddy. I ordered some motorcycle gear from the UK, and they had a special discount for UK customers only, but I went ahead and got it anyway.

I remember feeling a bit chuffed about it, but decided the trip to the island would be far too costly to take matters into my own hands...

I hope you explore all the possibilities! Good luck!

Charles

If you order from Tower you can go back and look up your tickets in the history of your purchases, yea? Thats how I found mine.

[r1derbike]

Thanks, Nort! I've already done that, and of course my purchase was in Oct. of '04 (they didn't even have G3 in stock), so I don't qualify for the receipt related 100.00 merchandise certificate contingent, so I went to the attic and found the box/UPC.

I'm just happy to get the 75.00 merchandise credit, at this point, as it is MOST generous, given how long I've had G3. :D

EDIT: Just pulled the trigger on the order, with the 25.00 discount code. Looks like they are out of stock, as item is backordered, and projected arrival early Nov.

I can wait!

Charles

[Kmot]

The rebate is indeed generous and a most compelling incentive to upgrade. Also, looking at the G4 page up now on RealFlight, and the various videos and screen shots on the 'net has made it seem so tempting to get.

I wanted water and float planes. Now they are available. The price point with the rebate is very palatable. As opjose pointed out, with the SS#1 discount of $30 plus the $75 merchandise rebate and then no tax (for me) and free shipping the net price is $94.98 plus I get a free 4-way glow plug wrench worth $3.99 for a bottom net price of $90.99

I'm now looking forward to receiving my G4. :)

[opjose]

I wanted water and float planes. Now they are available. The price point with the rebate is very palatable. As opjose pointed out, with the SS#1 discount of $30 plus the $75 merchandise rebate and then no tax (for me) and free shipping the net price is $94.98 plus I get a free 4-way glow plug wrench worth $3.99 for a bottom net price of $90.99

I'm now looking forward to receiving my G4. :)

Shoot I missed the wrench! :eek:

[STANG KILLA SS]

i just picked up G4 for $170! :D (no rebate, i had G2 lite, just bought it outright)
its on the way today! :)

[r1derbike]

Good on ya' stang! I just need to figure out what merchandise I want with the 75 buck merchandise credit. I hope G4 arrives pretty quickly, as you have to register G4, before the credit is given.

Edit: Jim's "sell the old stuff on ebay" suggestion literally sealed-the-deal for me. I had not even thought of selling G3, but his pointer made a lot of sense.

I've already got a partial wish/want list made, for when the credit is activated.

Charles

[jbourke]

I had not even thought of selling G3, but his pointer made a lot of sense.


Yeah that should be a real help for people on a budget. My guess, though, is that most people will just hold on to G3. Many R/C-ers have second machines and it is nice to have a version for the kids, an extra controller for multi-mode, a backup in case you drop your Interlink Elite and it has to go in for repair, etc.

Jim

[healthyfatboy]

i just picked up G4 for $170! :D (no rebate, i had G2 lite, just bought it outright)
its on the way today! :)

How does having G2 Lite have to do with getting G4 cheaper? That's the version I have (since they don't have any more replacement G2 disks :mad: ) and it would be nice to get it a little cheaper.

[pplace]

That's what he was saying. He has G2Lite so there was no rebate that "helped" him purchase G4. So he had to pay the total purchase price for G4 (outright)

Hope that clarifies it for you

[jeffpn]

i believe Tower Hobbies has a $30 discount to make it $170

[r1derbike]

a backup in case you drop your Interlink Elite and it has to go in for repair, etc.
That makes a lot of sense too! I remember getting my first interlink, with a problem right out of the box with a dislodged gimbal and dislodged rear connector circuit board.

I did the repairs myself, as I couldn't bear to be without the controller.

Jim, would there be any issues with the new G4 software not recognizing the older controller, if it was used, in case the inevitable happens? Would a total reinstall of G4 be needed, and then enter the old controller S.N.? Or is there an easy workaround?

Thanks! I just like to cover all the bases, being the picky type... ;)

Charles

[jeffpn]

r1derbike, that's not what jim is saying. He means that if your G4 controller breaks, you can go back to your G3 program while the G4 controller is being repaired. The G3 controller will not work as the only controller for G4

[healthyfatboy]

i believe Tower Hobbies has a $30 discount to make it $170

The most I have seen is a $25 discount that I get e-mails about with their newsletter. How do you go about getting the $30 AND free shipping? I haven't seen anything about free shipping in any of the e-mails I got.

[STANG KILLA SS]

That's what he was saying. He has G2Lite so there was no rebate that "helped" him purchase G4. So he had to pay the total purchase price for G4 (outright)

Hope that clarifies it for you

yep thats what i was saying,

jeffpn, no i bought it from a freind that owns a HS.

that tower deal sounds as good as mine, but ive heard there out of stock so it does no good. (i cant get G4 to show up in a tower search, there search engine has ALWAYS sucked)

[r1derbike]

Thanks Jeff...wishful thinkin', on my part... :)

Charles

[r1derbike]

Stang, I don't know if this is the link you are lookin' for, but here goes anyway:

http://www.towerhobbies.com/products/realflight/gpmz4420m.html

Charles

[mahbouni]

www.realflight.com/promos/rf-g4-rebate-form.pdfSo because I'm not in North America I don't get a rebate. How sad! No way I'm paying full whack for it. I'll just stick with G3.5 for now and when I feel I need to upgrade I'll go with Phoenix because of their free updates.

[0xdeadbeef]

So because I'm not in North America I don't get a rebate. How sad! No way I'm paying full whack for it. I'll just stick with G3.5 for now and when I feel I need to upgrade I'll go with Phoenix because of their free updates.

You're not alone. You, me and 95% percent of the world's population get a rebate $0. Nothing, nada, zilch. It's a shame that Tower Hobbies gives us a $25 rebate no matter where we are from or what we bought before, but KE/GP treats us like 2nd rate customers - although we paid much more for G3 than US customers. Really sounds like they don't care for our money or opinion (an assumption that is also confirmed by the poor support for metrical units).

Though I commiserate with you, I'd guess that Phoenix is not really an alternative right now. They promised the developer kit a year ago and it's still uncertain if/when it will ever come out. So neither can you create custom aircrafts nor flying fields for Phoenix. I guess I couldn't live without 3D fields either. Unfortunately, the other European alternatives (namely Aerofly Deluxe Pro and Reflex XTR) are stagnating feature wise as well. And both share the lack of a modern 3D engine for the 3D sites. The iVol looks like an interesting concept though.

And about free updates: as far as I know, the updates for Phoenix only included smaller bug fixes and a few new aircraft models up to now. Compared to the G3.5 update, this doesn't look very promising. If (and this is a big IF) a future version of Phoenix will support decent 3D fields, I wouldn't be surprised if they'd make it a new full prize product as well.

So I guess our options right now are:
1) Ignore KE's lack of respect to international customers, take Tower's rebate instead, sell G3 on eBay.
2) Stay with G3.5. No water flying, no updates. Decreasing number of custom planes/helis/airports.

I'm still wrestling with this decision. G4 doesn't seem to have any of the improvements that I hoped for. My only reason to buy it would be the hope that some of these improvements will be implemented during G4's life cycle. Then again, right now, as long as G4 is not available in Europe at all, chances are that selling G3 on eBay will make the change to G4 relatively inexpensive. If I'll wait some months, this will most probably not be the case.
*SIGH*

[Top Thumb]

Well, all hope is not lost. I found my receipt and it was dated May 8, 2007 so I guess I lucked out this time. My G3.5 is sold as soon as I get G4 whenever it comes in(backordered) so with the rebate I am going to make money :) About time something went in my favor....

[opjose]

So because I'm not in North America I don't get a rebate. How sad! No way I'm paying full whack for it. I'll just stick with G3.5 for now and when I feel I need to upgrade I'll go with Phoenix because of their free updates.

Or you could wait and see what your supply channel comes up with for rebates.

You've made the assumption that there will be no rebate for non North America orders.

Have you seen ANY post from KE that this is actually true?

Usually it can take a few weeks before these things are hammered out via the other distribution channels.

[0xdeadbeef]

Or you could wait and see what your supply channel comes up with for rebates.
You've made the assumption that there will be no rebate for non North America orders.
Have you seen ANY post from KE that this is actually true?
Usually it can take a few weeks before these things are hammered out via the other distribution channels.
Well, there may be always hope, but there's absolutely no sign of a rebate for international customers either. Was there a rebate for G2 to G3? Nope!
All we hear from KE/GP is that they are delegating this to international distributors and dealers. But why would my dealer or distributor want to give me a rebate for G4? They simply have no reason to do so - so they won't.

Besides: giving no rebate to international customers even if they buy/bought in the US has nothing to do with distribution channels. We're not only excluded because we bought G3 outside the US, but solely because we live outside the US. This is simply a discrimination against customers from outside North America.
It's not so much the 30 bucks that bug me but the whole attitude.

[r1derbike]

Ox, while I may understand your "beef", isn't Great Planes ultimately responsible for the rebates/merchandise allowance?

Shouldn't your "beef" be directed to Great Planes only?

Charles

[0xdeadbeef]

I have no insight in the contracts between KE, GP and their distributors. So instead of putting the blame on only one of the concerned parties, I tried to be diplomatic ;)

[opjose]

Besides: giving no rebate to international customers even if they buy/bought in the US has nothing to do with distribution channels. We're not only excluded because we bought G3 outside the US, but solely because we live outside the US. This is simply a discrimination against customers from outside North America.
It's not so much the 30 bucks that bug me but the whole attitude.

Yeah, I don't quite understand why for instance Tower wouldn't honor the rebate on G4 purchased through them, but shipped internationally.

At the worst the transaction occurs in the U.S. for all intents and purposes, and it could at worst be stipulated that the merchandise certificate has to apply to their products purchased through them... so as not to get the International supply chain involved.

Now what would happen if for instance you sent me your UPC's, and I purchased it for you, got the rebate and applied it against another purchase for you.

Technically I as the purchaser, am a resident, but then you as the owner are not.

Does this still apply?

[0xdeadbeef]

That's a kind offer, but I don't want to obtain my rebate by fraud.
Besides, I guess it wouldn't work. Note that I registered my copy of G3 to my address in Germany and G4 has to be registered to the same person and address as G3.
This makes clear that I'm no resident of North America and thus won't get the rebate - no matter if a US citizen bought it or not.
At least that's how I understand the rebate form.

[r1derbike]

I tried to be diplomatic
Heh-heh! LOL!

Charles

[mahbouni]

Even if Tower Hobbies give us foreigners the rebate and send us a check for $30, We would still have to pay this into our local bank accounts, which would incur FX fees. For me it's not about the money either. I've spent $1000's on this hobby just this year. However I won't be treated like a Mug and GreatPlanes are not having any more of my money if they behave like this.

[jeffpn]

Playing devil's advocate here, would you overseaers be happier if nobody got a rebate?

[inky00]

Well, there may be always hope, but there's absolutely no sign of a rebate for international customers either. Was there a rebate for G2 to G3? Nope!
All we hear from KE/GP is that they are delegating this to international distributors and dealers. But why would my dealer or distributor want to give me a rebate for G4? They simply have no reason to do so - so they won't.

Besides: giving no rebate to international customers even if they buy/bought in the US has nothing to do with distribution channels. We're not only excluded because we bought G3 outside the US, but solely because we live outside the US. This is simply a discrimination against customers from outside North America.
It's not so much the 30 bucks that bug me but the whole attitude.


I agree with you 100%,they are making us feel like because we aren't American that we some how don't deserve a rebate like all the Americans.I was considering buying G4 but with policies like that i think i will give it a miss.I dont understand why if we buy direct from Greatplanes we cannot get the rebate aswell.I am seriously considering quitting modelling for this sim as i feel i have contributed loads to the sim and community as a whole and they cannot even stretch to rebate international users.I will finish the Showtime i am working on but after that i dont know whether i will continue.

[r1derbike]

Just because the UK motorcycle company didn't give me a discount, as they obviously did for their UK customers, I think I'll quit motorcycling, shoot myself in the foot, cut my nose off to spite my face, stick my head into a gas oven, put a plastic bag over my head and tie around my neck tightly, and if all the above didn't end it all for me, have a match at the ready as a last resort. :D

PPUULLEEZZE!

We would still have to pay this into our local bank accounts, which would incur FX fees. For me it's not about the money either.
Am I reading the above correctly? Even if you DO get a 30 buck rebate, you are griping about having to pay FX fees on it? And it's not about the money? :D

As someone already said, "I think I'll take all my toys and go home..." :D

Charles

[inky00]

Just because the UK motorcycle company didn't give me a discount, as they obviously did for their UK customers, I think I'll quit motorcycling, shoot myself in the foot, cut my nose off to spite my face, stick my head into a gas oven, put a plastic bag over my head and tie around my neck tightly, and if all the above didn't end it all for me, have a match at the ready as a last resort. :D

PPUULLEEZZE!
I am sure that a British company would think alot more of its overseas customers than to only offer a discount to british customers.If you buy direct from them i am sure you would get the same discount as any one else.What i dont like is the fact that because i live in a different country i am in some way different from the American customer,why is that?
Surely if we buy the new version direct from Greatplanes and can provide our serial number like everyone else then why cant we get the same deal.The world is alot smaller these days as we can buy from just about anywhere online and get discounts in the process.

[opjose]

I am sure that a British company would think alot more of its overseas customers than to only offer a discount to british customers.If you buy direct from them i am sure you would get the same discount as any one else..

Not true... I've been in the same boat with rebates, etc. on multiple occasions, not being given to me because I'm an American customer of a UK product.

[r1derbike]

Inky, I prolly speak for a lot of users, that it would be a shame to lose your talents (which you've been very generous with) because of a lack-of-rebate issue.

All my over-the-top post was meant to drive home (besides inject a bit of humor), was the fact that others have been subjected to the same "treatment" here (whether intended or not) as customers who don't qualify for the rebate elsewhere.

Again, it would be a shame to lose your talents, and generosity over such an issue.

I share your feelings, as I've not received equal opportunity for discounts on the worldwide market, but I've moved on.

I enjoy your work, as many do.

Charles

[0xdeadbeef]

I can understand that from a business point of view, giving rebates make sense especially in countries were there is a strong competitor for that product type.

E.g. a car by Renault might be cheaper in Germany than in France since German customers prefer to buy German cars and French customers prefer to buy French cars. Just an example and it might not be true due to other factors, but you know what I mean.

Then again, 3 of the 5 "big" RC simulators are from Europe. AFPD and Reflex are from Germany, while Phoenix is from the UK. In the US, FSOne emerged as competitor. Still, the rebate is given only in North America. Even from a sales perspective, this is somewhat strange.

Anyway, as mentioned in the other thread, I decided to take Tower's rebate and to benefit from the low dollar price by buying directly from the US. So if my parcel won't be dropped in the pond, I'm on the G4 train now. This doesn't mean though that I'm happy being given no rebate by KE/GP.

[opjose]

Anyway, as mentioned in the other thread, I decided to take Tower's rebate and to benefit from the low dollar price by buying directly from the US. So if my parcel won't be dropped in the pond, I'm on the G4 train now. This doesn't mean though that I'm happy being given no rebate by KE/GP.

I hope that they will address this.

I is perceived as "unfair" by the consumer.

[Kaiser]

As far as I'm concerned G3.5 is the end of the line for me. The fact that rebates are for N.America only is a poor show! The support for Heli users is not as good as it could be or should be! Base models of current popular models such as the X600 etc should be available as a free up date as the addons offer little else to someone who uses RF for Heli practice the standard set with G4 just sucks big time!

In my opinion the best way to go for me is to buy Phoenix for £76 I will have access to free updates code and models I will still have G3.5 if I need or want to use it 3.5 is good enough as it is for Heli practice and the odd on-line session rippling water is not really a wow for me or the ability to land and takeoff from it. Phoenix offers rippling water I have to use my Radio which I have to do with RF anyway to get decent Heli controls and I can join on-line sessions if I wish. Why would I pay to update G3.5 to G4 rebate or no rebate I have been through G2 to G3 upgrade and that's enough for me I don't feel that that G4 is a worth while investment of my money time or loyalty an longer.

I'm sure the change to Phoenix will be a fresh and welcome one.

If it had not been for the work that other users had put in creating new models I would have brought Phoenix a long time ago. I would like to say thanks to all those who worked on the new models it is much appreciated myself and many others I'm sure.

I think a better Up date model would have been the Addon as they are should be free content additions such as current models should be available to all users. G3.5 could have been a fee paid update maybe with a rebate for users purchasing near to the G4 release.

As for the Hardware change current users should have an upgrade path which doesn't need the hardware upgrade and new purchases would include the new controller.

But then I guess its hard to please all the people all of the time and make a few more bucks on the way. I just happen to fall in to the dissatisfied portion this time. Fortunately there is a solution to my plight! Right off to E-bay maybe I will get Phoenix for a bit less than £76-$160 and see how the other half live.

My comments are in no way directed at the quality of RF G3 3.5 or G4 as a product but the business model for me is not one I wish to be apart of any longer. I'm sure that many other people have other opinions.

[r1derbike]

Since GP/RF/KE supply the global market, it's going to be nearly impossible to keep everybody happy, all the time.

When I'm buying globally, I go WOOHOO! when I get a discount, and I go PPHHTT! when I don't. That's about the extent of my reaction, then I move on.

If anyone is dissatisfied with the G4 rebate/merchandise allowance particulars, Great Planes is ultimately responsible for the details, so by all means, let them know how you feel about it!

Charles

[opjose]

As for the Hardware change current users should have an upgrade path which doesn't need the hardware upgrade and new purchases would include the new controller.

But then I guess its hard to please all the people all of the time and make a few more bucks on the way. I just happen to fall in to the dissatisfied portion this time.

Fortunately there is a solution to my plight! Right off to E-bay maybe I will get Phoenix for a bit less than £76-$160 and see how the other half live.

My comments are in no way directed at the quality of RF G3 3.5 or G4 as a product but the business model for me is not one I wish to be apart of any longer. I'm sure that many other people have other opinions.

This is pretty much the same argument people were screaming here about the North American G4 rebate and release.

We heard this many times, and there were complaints in many directions...

e.g.

"I will not buy it if KE changes the physics as it renders current planes obsolete"
While the very next poster put down.
"I will not buy it UNLESS KE changes the physics, as otherwise I'm not getting enough for my money"...

Sheez!!!!

We heard the same thing about the rebate... I advised a "wait and see" approach.

Greatplanes actually came through with a pretty good rebate program.

Now the International customers are still left out in the cold so to speak... but before making these sweaping pronouncements, you MAY want to wait until the holidays approach.

You may find ( especially if you bother e-mailing Great Planes directly instead of posting here... ) that the International channels may also offer something similiar.

The "I'm going with XYZ instead", basically means you've given up on any sort of rebate or incentive.

Historically this type of thing takes longer before it is announced.

Fire off an e-mail to Great Planes.

Maybe if more International Customers do, they'll push their distro channels too.

Good luck with Phoenix if you go that route. I expect that you'll at some point wished you had not sold G3.

[Johndou]

This is pretty much the same argument ...

... I expect that you'll at some point wished you had not sold G3.

Some will - some won't wish that they hadn't sold G3 ...

You have a bunch who aren't happy with the rebate that they're not getting - those outside of the US.

Then you have a group who aren't happy about losing all of their "Add-ons".

Then you have a group who have just spent $50.00 to have their controllers repaired only to learn that there's an upgrade that comes with a new controller.

Then you have the group who fly together - online - and one of them can't afford to upgrade so none of them will.

Then you have the group who's systems won't support the new G4 requirements without significant lose of graphics capabilities.

Then, of course, you have the group who simply can't afford it, or would rather spend their money for other R/C related items.

There are a lot more people out there who won't be buying G4 then there are who have or will.

I realize that none of these are KnifeEdge's problems. But, eventually you have enough groups of people not buying G4 that RealFlights profits start to decline.

Then where does that leave KnifeEdge?

Maybe the same place as Nizz, Inky, etc ...?

Customer satisfaction is just - if not more - important then product satisfaction.

[Kaiser]

I wont be upset at selling G3 the two sets I own will remain in my possession and friends that visit will go head to head business as usual. For me G3.5 is ok I stopped buying the add-ons disks after some of the ones I used in G2 were no good in G3 support was asked for in an E-mail to GP and not a single reply! So no more investment from me in another add-on! I still have the old add-ons I still have G2 I don't need to sell them.

I use G3.5 for Helies full stop the support for helies on G anything is taking the P*SS as far as I'm concerned. New models are not added with out an add-on which offers very little to a Heli user! £29 for 4 unpopular helies Hummm good deal.

As I said if it were not for the members of the forum who take the time to bring current models to the swap page I would have been gone long ago.

I have used Phoenix, about 20 people I know at my fixed wing club and almost everyone at the Heli club own Phoenix. I could count on one hand the people I know that have Gxx period. It requires a low-end machine it has good physics it uses my radio which I have to use anyway with G3 or 4 to have a usable Heli radio.

G4 could have been an update/addon using an old G3 controller and new purchases could have recived the new style no real biggie. My controllers work just fine I know how to use a mouse and where the menu is! I don't need digital trims on a bloody sim!

I lose how exactly? I pay £76 for a whole new product with free updates I support my own economy. I still have G3 I had my moneys worth so no complaints there! As a product it is OK I never said other wise. Maybe the point is that G3 was a great product and I don't see the value G4 brings apart from a point less up grade in order to get a duck pond or a bird bath which ever way you want to see it! For some the water feature is a major bonus but apart from novelty I doubt it will be a great concern to the average user. I think better ground handling in G3 would have been more useful. But as a heli pilot I don't get upset about it apart from autos the ground handling is not an issue for me but it is for the greater majority!
It looks like G4 has inherited the ground handling of G3. I doubt the take off on water is any different to that of tarmac or grass in G4 and I really don't care. If they could make the water take off choppy they could make the turf choppy to with changing resistance I haven't seen anything to say they have done that in G4.

I don't need to wait till after the Holidays to chill or see what rebate comes I already know I wont buy G4 what ever the deal! I will remain a happy G3.5 owner so long as it lasts!

Software is good the business model sucks! Who ever is to blame KE or GP I will vote the only way I can and that in this case is to splash the cash somewhere else!

I'm not a dissatisfied customer as I wont be a customer of G4. If G3 loses the support of Knifeedge in the future I will stack it up with G2 and move on. If it were an upgrade I would probably have gone with it at a future date when I needed to no doubt sooner rather than later as thats not an option I wont be going with it.

I think GP have made a poor judgment as the majority of people on G3/3.5 have no real need to make the move and the online hosts will remain very active what ever happens because the second hand market in G3 will ensure it does. I would think it will be stronger than G4 in that respect for a long time to come as most people are happy with G3/3.5 even with its faults.

This is my opinion and should not be taken as a personal insult if you have formed an alternative view!

Johndou has made a far better point than me in far fewer words.

r1derbike

The point is not so much the rebate if I wanted to buy another two copies I would go and buy them...I can't see the point in this form of update that cuts out the current users. G2 was not USB so it was a worth while up date as the computer I/O set-up was moving on. The blame is irrelevant KE GP they are a joint venture I don't see KE running off to a new distributor so they are happy with the business ethic! This is only a software update rapped up as some big deal digital trims Humm and a puddle to play in Hummm and if you live in N. America and buy it soon you get a few bucks off if you don't jump now you will pay $199 like everyone else oh and thanks for your previous investment! Oh and if you like to fly helies Ha bloody Ha ha!

RIP G3 11-2004 to 11-2007 Looks like a 3 year cycle not too bad if your in at the start.

[md98677]

Many posts are correct in being upset about the rebate, and then there are many posts directed at how many people will be upset with the new G4 release. Those that can't afford to make the jump, like me, and those that have already purchased it and are unhappy! What is KE thinking? I have a great deal invested in G3.5 and to make another investment, NOT HAPPENING, not only I cannot afford to do an upgrade of this caliber, but I shouldn't have to pay for an upgade! This G4 product should have just been an update for G3.5 as just adding water is about the only feature that people see.
It is already looking like not only this rebate issue, but the whole realm of the G4 senario is going to backfire on KE. I am not completely happy with G3.5 but I am not complaining either, I too am just stating a personal opinion not aimed at anyone, so don't take my words the wrong way. People have already invested in a pretty decent program, and now like me, their being cheated out of an upgade that will eventually make G3.5 void and were just out! Money not well spent as I see it. So what should people like myself do? The only thing I can do is continue using G3.5 until which time I can afford to purchase another program, and it won't be G anything...I think it's time to move on...I like many others are not pleased with being set aside because we cannot afford to upgrade our computers, or afford to purchase a two hundred dollar upgrade...

[r1derbike]

The blame is irrelevant KE GP they are a joint venture
As I stated before, complaints about the G4 rebate/merchandise allowance would carry much more weight, if they were directed to Great Planes, as they are ultimately responsible for the details.

This is only a software update rapped up as some big deal digital trims Humm and a puddle to play in Hummm and if you live in N. America and buy it soon you get a few bucks off if you don't jump now you will pay $199 like everyone else oh and thanks for your previous investment! Oh and if you like to fly helies Ha bloody Ha ha!
People who want G4 will buy it, people who don't, won't! :D Very simple! :D

RIP G3 11-2004 to 11-2007 Looks like a 3 year cycle not too bad if your in at the start.
If memory serves, G3xxx is the best selling RC sim on the planet. I don't think RIP is in their vocabulary, at this point! :D

Charles

[r1derbike]

People have already invested in a pretty decent program, and now like me, their being cheated out of an upgade that will eventually make G3.5 void
I'm having a hard time trying to understand this. Being cheated out of something usually means that you have paid for something, and received nothing in return.

Just for the sake of argument, an analogy:

I'm a Windows XP user. Windows Vista has been introduced to replace XP. Am I to feel I have been cheated out of an operating system, because Microsoft is charging for it, and I'm not willing to pay for it?

People who have G3xxx, still have G3xxx! How may they be cheated out of anything?

Charles

[Johndou]

I'm having a hard time trying to understand this. Being cheated out of something usually means that you have paid for something, and received nothing in return.

Just for the sake of argument, an analogy:

I'm a Windows XP user. Windows Vista has been introduced to replace XP. Am I to feel I have been cheated out of an operating system, because Microsoft is charging for it, and I'm not willing to pay for it?

People who have G3xxx, still have G3xxx! How may they be cheated out of anything?

Charles

Your analogy makes sense except for one miner point. When Microsoft introduced Vista – or when Microsoft introduced Windows XP or Windows 2000, or Windows 98 – they didn’t stop supporting their previous release. How long has Windows ’98 been obsolete? Yet Microsoft continued supporting it and introduced updates until just last year.

KnifeEdge introduced G3 and immediately stopped supporting and upgrading G2 making G2 obsolete. Now they’ve introduced G4 and have stopped supporting and upgrading G3.5. Big - as in major – difference from Microsoft and many other software developers.

The introduction of a new product is a good thing – the obsolescence of a previous release and still a viable product – STILL the number one selling RC sim on the market – is a bad thing.

See the difference?

[opjose]

Some will - some won't wish that they hadn't sold G3 ...

You have a bunch who aren't happy with the rebate that they're not getting - those outside of the US.



Yes, hopefully this will be addressed.


Then you have a group who aren't happy about losing all of their "Add-ons".



Which KE says that they are already working on... not really a big issue assuming they come through, and usually once they announce something like this, they do.


Then you have a group who have just spent $50.00 to have their controllers repaired only to learn that there's an upgrade that comes with a new controller.


That doesn't really apply here. The number is relatively small. KE tends to repair the controllers for shipping, and damage to the controller is not an upgrade issue.



Then you have the group who fly together - online - and one of them can't afford to upgrade so none of them will.



That's an assumption. From what I've seen online "groups" are not cohesive enough to do as you say.

One will upgrade to a new rev, and others will go online only with people using their older revs.


Then you have the group who's systems won't support the new G4 requirements without significant lose of graphics capabilities.


There are no real "new" requirements. DX9 compliance has always been cited as necessary. G4 is a bit stricter with this.

The G3 users were/are in the same boat.



Then, of course, you have the group who simply can't afford it, or would rather spend their money for other R/C related items.


That's always the case with anything.



There are a lot more people out there who won't be buying G4 then there are who have or will.

I realize that none of these are KnifeEdge's problems. But, eventually you have enough groups of people not buying G4 that RealFlights profits start to decline.



Then there are a lot of people who will not be buying new plasma TV's over the holidays too... but Plasma sales will remain strong...

You've cited several reasons why people might not purchase G4. Some may be valid, others are normal for any purchase. But these same reasons apply for almost anything.

I'd be surprised if G4 does poorly.

Remember that their main target is not "us" the "converted", but rather those looking to purchase a new sim.

Those people are first wowed by the graphics, reviews, and the fact that someone in their club considers it so accurate that it is used for training.

Around here G3 is the "ONLY" recommended heli sim for the club heli guys.
When a newbie starts in on helis, the first thing they are told to buy is G3.

Likewise for fledgling plane pilots, G3 is recommended ( not as strongly as for the heli guys ) as the preferred sim.

This applies to most clubs in my area.

As a result G3 is always stocked by the LHS', while FSOne went on display for about 3-5 months and has now been removed.

I wonder which sim is going to do better in sales?

[r1derbike]

Johndou, your support assessment observation also lacks one very important point. While KE has been generous enough to supply support/guidance via their KE software website, Great Planes has taken the burden of technical/product support, and KE has numerous times referred support questions, to Great Planes.

I don't see my present G3 flight-sim as obsolete, nor will it be as long as I own it. There always has been, and will be plenty of forum support/www. archives for previous versions of RealFlight software.

You only have to use your "search" function, and support doors will open wide, for you, on the great worldwide web.

I don't own G2, so there are no support issues affecting me.

EDIT: Last time I looked, KE forum support here includes G2, G3, G3.5 and G4. Claims of the sky is falling, are unfounded.

So, no, I see no difference! :D

Charles

[opjose]

I wont be upset at selling G3 the two sets I own will remain in my possession and friends that visit will go head to head business as usual. For me G3.5 is ok


I still have G3 I had my moneys worth so no complaints there! As a product it is OK I never said other wise. Maybe the point is that G3 was a great product and I don't see the value G4 brings apart from a point less up grade in order to get a duck pond or a bird bath which ever way you want to see it!



I guess that IS the point...

You have something that already works fine for you, so why bother to upgrade?

No one says you really have to, and some will be perfectly fine with the version they already have.

I'm glad that the rebate program allows me to upgrade for a nominal price yet keep my current version, which will not be religated to my family room plasma multimedia computer system...

[Johndou]

Johndou, your support assessment observation also lacks one very important point. While KE has been generous enough to supply support/guidance via their KE software website, Great Planes has taken the burden of technical/product support, and KE has numerous times referred support questions, to Great Planes.

#1 - KE has been generous enough to supply a website where user helps user with “guidance” issues. As you have pointed out.

#2 - Great Planes has linked their product support website to KE’s support website (along with virtually all phone calls & emails). Refer to #1 …

The difference, in case you haven’t noticed, is that KE and GP refers any continuing support for their “out dated” software to their customers. They no longer burden themselves with updates, patches, bug fixes, customer guidance or support.


I don't see my present G3 flight-sim as obsolete, nor will it be as long as I own it. There always has been, and will be plenty of forum support/www. archives for previous versions of RealFlight software.

You only have to use your "search" function, and support doors will open wide, for you, on the great worldwide web.

I don't own G2, so there are no support issues affecting me.

I agree, plenty of forum support. The “community” as it’s referred to by Jim Bourke, has saved KE hundreds of thousands of man hours by answering some rather complex questions at times. Although, I’m still not sure how you equate that with software support. I’ve always considered them two separate and quite distinct functions. Users helping users does nothing to fix bugs and the last I looked KE had a number of bugs in G2 that they never did address – but then like you I don’t own G2 so it’s not an issue - of course the same holds true for G3.5. The latest bug reported shortly after the intro of G4 has never been addressed - do you really expect it to be?



EDIT: Last time I looked, KE forum support here includes G2, G3, G3.5 and G4. Claims of the sky is falling, are unfounded.

So, no, I see no difference! :D

Charles

If I gave you the impression that the sky was falling with this minor issue, I’d hate to think what would happen if we were talking about NASA’s inability to track and detect small meteorites on a collision course with Earth … :eek:

Apparently we’ll just have to agree to disagree. My interpretation of a software company supporting its software releases is obviously different then yours. I’m sure that G3 (or G3.5) will remain a viable product for years to come (or at least until G4.5 comes out - in time for next years Christmas rush). Mainly because of the community support it has – not because I expect KE to continue its past support. After all it is, based on KE’s own announcement, an obsolete piece of software.

[r1derbike]

Apparently we’ll just have to agree to disagree.

Yes, let's move on, shall we? :D

[ven2s]

So is it true that G3.5 will recieve no more updates??

[pplace]

So is it true that G3.5 will receive no more updates??

I was just going to reply to your post (then refreshed the screen and noticed you had deleted and changed it?

I was going to ask about the comment: That KE has stopped upgrading G3.5 and I was going to ask where you got the facts.

But you must have known those questions were coming...hence the reason you changed your post

[ven2s]

Actually, what you saw was from another post and I pressed enter or my space bar and it went right to the the site. The posted question was in response to the post you saw, which was not my own to begin with. So...are they going to stop doing updates for G3.5??? :confused:

[pplace]

I couldn't answer that question without speculating? But do I care if they stop supporting it? NO...I have G4!haha

[ven2s]

Uh...great. So can someone who does know please give me a straight answer, once again, to a simple question?? Will updates be applied to G3.5, I really don't care if you have G4 or not. ;)

[phrank]

As this is a user forum, you're going to get user answers.
Best to PM the KE guys directly, only they would know.

This user's opinion is this:
They have more Expansion packs coming, if they want to get some money from the already large 3.5 base, then it's to their benefit to offer an update to make the future expansion pack compatible with 3.5 customers. ...Unless it's a watercraft...

[r1derbike]

ven2s, you should probably direct that question to Great Planes Technical Support, unless you want to PM Jim Bourke here.

Links below:

http://www.gpsoftware.com/realflightg3.htm

email: rfsupport@greatplanes.com

Charles

[ven2s]

Thanks, I will. I hope they keep upgrading the software because that just would not make sense. But we'll see.

[opjose]

Actually, what you saw was from another post and I pressed enter or my space bar and it went right to the the site. The posted question was in response to the post you saw, which was not my own to begin with. So...are they going to stop doing updates for G3.5??? :confused:

Unfortunately the answer is "probably".

It is concievable that in order to cover all of the bases, future expansion packs may also feature updates, but you can expect that at some point in the future this will stop.

Taking a wild guess ( as I'm not privy to KE's internal communications... ) I'd venture to say that you may yet see a couple of updates for G3.5 or more.

But I'll bet that within 2 years this will stop.

[ven2s]

You probably understand the reason I am asking this question. Since G3.5 has such a broad customer base already, it just seems that they would be shooting themselves in the foot by stopping updates in software. I know most G4 people could care less, but c'mon...even Microsoft wouldn't do that to a viable product; at least not until the majority of people have gone over to the newer system. Realistically, I know that updates will eventually cease; 2 years is ok but I thought maybe they already stopped. I will check on this.

[Law]

Microsoft Windows 98 was "replaced" by Microsoft Windows 2000 in Feb of 2000. Windows continued support of Windows 98 until July of 2006. They still support Windows 2000 and Windows Millennium. Both of which were "replaced" when XP was released in 2001.

I wouldn't expect that kind of support from a small software developer like KE, logistically speaking it's just not feasable. Looking through the archives it appears that KE stopped updating G2 as soon as G3 was released. Will they do the same with G3 now that G4 is released? We'll have to see if history repeats itself.

[chinookmark]

What do they mean by "Optional merchandise certificates good only at original place of purchase for Aquacraft, (etc ...)"

I bought G4 from Readyheli. Does that mean I'd have to use the certificate there?

[MikeyTG]

... stick my head into a gas oven, put a plastic bag over my head and tie around my neck tightly, ...

Won't the plastic bag negate the effect of the oven? :)

[Kmot]

What do they mean by "Optional merchandise certificates good only at original place of purchase for Aquacraft, (etc ...)"

I bought G4 from Readyheli. Does that mean I'd have to use the certificate there?
If you can read and understand clear English............. :p

[knee-u-bee]

So this merchandise certificate for that amount, is like a cashiers check or something? What exactly is that?

[pilot07]

it means the store u bought realflight at will credit you $75..... i think

[knee-u-bee]

anyone else with a little more info plz answer.

[opjose]

What more do you need to know?

You download the certificate, enter what you need to fill out, and send it off.

You'll get back a credit voucher that can be used at places honoring the G4 vouchers... such as Tower.

It's spelled out in the PDF file's fine print.

[churlock]

What surprises me is that they are even offering a rebate. Think in terms of economics. How big is the market for rc sims?? 100,000 maybe? Divide that up with competing sims, i.e., market share. Say they sell 50,000 units. A $100 profit per unit?? $5mil profit??? Maybe?? How many employees to feed?? 100?? That's $50k/employee. It seems to me that a rebate really cuts into their margins.

These are all WAG's, but still...to offer a rebate of any kind does seem generous. I don't think they are getting rich, and we need them to continue improving the product. I might be way off base here, but I don't think by much.......

[Law]

G3.0 and G3.5 have quite a large following. RealFlight did a great job with those versions of their simulator and most - if not all - of the people who own them are quite happy with what they have. As has been discussed here there are some minor physics issues that the G3.0/.5 owners will not have to deal with, they won't loose a large portion of their "Add-on" planes and airports. They won't need to upgrade their graphics cards, etc. I would think that the people who own those versions have no real desire to upgrade to G4.0. At least those with limited financial means.

Without a large portion of the existing customers upgrading to G4.0 - and as you pointed out, the limited market - I could see sales for G4.0 being somewhat lacking.

So, what better way for RealFlight to encourage the sales of G4.0 then to offer a rebate to the owners of G3.0/G3.5? I see it as a very smart move on their part.

[opjose]

Over at RCU there is a thread where a person is complaining about the price of Sims and G3/G4 specifically.

I mentioned that you can discover the size of the potential total market by taking the number of AMA members and dividing by 8.

A competing, lesser priced sim ( Clearview ) developer came on and indicated that this was exactly how they came up with their potential market base, and he defended G3/G4's pricing scheme saying that this was as close as it could be cut and still offer all of the features found in G3/G4...

He also defended the "high quality Futaba style controller" included with G4 and mentioned that this too cut into profits.

Interesting statement coming from a competitor, and recognition that they didn't have the staff to do as KE has done.

[TreeHugger]

Hi, all!
Interesting statement coming from a competitor, and recognition that they didn't have the staff to do as KE has done.

That is just one way to interpret the statements about target audience and pricing. Another possible one is this: Since they (Clearview) have neither the staff nor the distribution/marketing machine to feed, they can still make some profit at a lower price. ;)

I did follow that particular thread (on a parallel rc universe) and I will agree to the points you made there, opjose. In fact, you are a master mythbuster! I'd just like to offer a different viewpoint.

Regards

[opjose]

Hi, all!


That is just one way to interpret the statements about target audience and pricing. Another possible one is this: Since they (Clearview) have neither the staff nor the distribution/marketing machine to feed, they can still make some profit at a lower price. ;)

Regards

Heh... heh...

Methinks you nailed it.

That seemed to be somewhat implicit in their comment... a bit of "faint praise".

[chinookmark]

You'll get back a credit voucher that can be used at places honoring the G4 vouchers... such as Tower.



That's what I wasn't clear about. From the fine print, it sounds to me like you can only use the certificate at the place you bought G4. I like your answer better.

[Kmot]

Has anyone received their rebate in the mail yet?

[jbull]

Yes, about a week ago :D

[churlock]

Yes, about a week ago :D
Wow, that WAS quick. I was expecting a lot longer "lag" time consistent with other rebaters. (I'm planning to use it on one of their expansion packs)

[Kmot]

Kewl! :cool:

[SilverEagle2]

So, I submitted ALL the info needed for my rebate and I get in the mail today my submission form back with a slip of paper saying I am missing the Proof of Purchase from the G4 box.

I checked 3 times to make sure before sealing the envelope that it was in there.

Looks like someone opend my envelope, dropped my UPC, and now I am out my rebate. :mad:

Anyone else have trouble like this.

Now because they have my UPC, I cannot get my rebate. And for something I did not do cause I know it was in there.

Interestingly enough, they know I bought it and have it cause I have to register it, and I bought it from Tower. They know for a fact that I have it, yet the burden is on me to provide something they lost.

Dang it.

[opjose]

So, I submitted ALL the info needed for my rebate and I get in the mail today my submission form back with a slip of paper saying I am missing the Proof of Purchase from the G4 box.

Interestingly enough, they know I bought it and have it cause I have to register it, and I bought it from Tower. They know for a fact that I have it, yet the burden is on me to provide something they lost.

Dang it.

That's one reason I photocopy it, keep a copy and put a photocopy of it inside the envelope stating that the original is stapled to the form itself.

You may have to call someone at tech support and explain what happened.

[Gbain]

By the way guys, this rebate is only available in the USA or Canada, so much for a level playing field for European and other users eh?

Gordon (a rather fed up European user) :mad:

[opjose]

By the way guys, this rebate is only available in the USA or Canada, so much for a level playing field for European and other users eh?

Gordon (a rather fed up European user) :mad:

From what KE has mentioned about this, the problem seems to be with the local distribution chain.

[jeffpn]

I sent off all the required paperwork to get my G4 rebate, and it got returned to me because the G3 serial was not registered. I had G3 almost since it's initial release, and I unregistered it and gave it to a friend. If the rebate department was on top of things, it would have been registered, since I unregistered it only 2 weeks ago. I sent the stuff in a month ago. GP's advice was to have my friend unregister it so that I can register it myself long enough to get the rebate. That's alot of shell game for only $30. I'm glad I didn't sell it on Ebay. What a pain! I've bought G2, G3, G4, 5 addons, and 4 expansion packs. That's almost $900 I've spent on RF software, and I have to send in the rebate form again, after unregistering my friend, reregistering for me, wait for the rebate, unregister me, and reregister my friend. That's what I get for not keeping G3 myself, I guess! :mad: :mad: :mad: So at least somebody out there can learn from my situation: Don't get rid of G3 until you have your rebate!!!!!

[pplace]

There's a rebate for G4? ;)

[Norton]

You guy's got me thinking,

I sent my re-bate in almost two months ago and still have not received anything so I gave them a call. After getting a person on the phone after only about a minute they said it was posted on Jan 15 and I should be getting it in the mail any day now.

All in all, I'm happy with the service. Sorry about you experience jeffpn, I do agree for 30 bucks that is a hassle.

[SilverEagle2]

So far they made good with me.

I explained the sit and they made concessions for me to complete the rebate process.

Way to go.

[rcnetwrkr]

Well, before everybody gets too excited about your G4 rebate certificate get a load of this:

I received mine a couple of days ago. I chose the $100 merchandise cert. Now while I'm not suprised at all that it can only be used at Tower (i'm fine with that), I was in fact appalled and outright frustrated to learn that to use it at all I must dust off my mail-order, "yes" I did say "MAIL ORDER" skills to use it. Thats right...if you want your rebate you will be placing your order same as you did the secret decoder ring from the back of the Capn Crunch box in 1975; and then I suppose there are those of you who will be young enough to have to research how to even perform the lost art of manual mail order the way your pioneer bretheren did it. What a bust! That part of the deal was never made known...you don't find this out till you get it and open the mail.

[r1derbike]

I lifted an eyebrow over that one too...oh well...somebody else made the rules!

Charles

[Norton]

Well, before everybody gets too excited about your G4 rebate certificate get a load of this:

I received mine a couple of days ago. I chose the $100 merchandise cert. Now while I'm not suprised at all that it can only be used at Tower (i'm fine with that), I was in fact appalled and outright frustrated to learn that to use it at all I must dust off my mail-order, "yes" I did say "MAIL ORDER" skills to use it. Thats right...if you want your rebate you will be placing your order same as you did the secret decoder ring from the back of the Capn Crunch box in 1975; and then I suppose there are those of you who will be young enough to have to research how to even perform the lost art of manual mail order the way your pioneer bretheren did it. What a bust! That part of the deal was never made known...you don't find this out till you get it and open the mail.


Come on mate?

You used be be able to this and now it's a pain? Are you so accustomed to the net that this a pain in the arse? Just plain lazy if you ask me.

Either way you look at it is a great deal, you got $100 dollars off the new version and you cant pay for a stamp?

Sad in my mind...

Also for a first post, blah blah.....

[josh0987]

Well, before everybody gets too excited about your G4 rebate certificate get a load of this:

I received mine a couple of days ago. I chose the $100 merchandise cert. Now while I'm not surprised at all that it can only be used at Tower (I'm fine with that), I was in fact appalled and outright frustrated to learn that to use it at all I must dust off my mail-order, "yes" I did say "MAIL ORDER" skills to use it. Thats right...if you want your rebate you will be placing your order same as you did the secret decoder ring from the back of the Capt. Crunch box in 1975; and then I suppose there are those of you who will be young enough to have to research how to even perform the lost art of manual mail order the way your pioneer brethren did it. What a bust! That part of the deal was never made known...you don't find this out till you get it and open the mail.I guess your penmanship isn't too great then huh?

[josh0987]

Sad in my mind...

Also for a first post, blah blah.....Hmm Yes... Yes indeed, what a waste of the First Post.

[jeffpn]

Here's an update to my post #142: my rebate check came today!! Thank you, GreatPlanes!!! :) :) :)

[pplace]

Well after 5 months of owning G4 I finally sent off my rebate form. (Now that the release of Exp Pack 5 has happened) the question.......

For those that have sent off for the $75 merchandise rebate: How long is it valid for?

I will obviously use part of it on Exp 5....but I really don't care for Exp 1 & 2 (I already have 3 & 4) I know I could use it for multiple other things (non G4 related) but it's not a big deal to me....so I would possibly just hold onto the remaining balance until Exp 6? Is there an expiration date for the rebate balance?

Thanks

[dhk79]

Don't feel too bad. I sent my rebate form off, but then before I got the rebate back, I sold my copy of G3. Of course I was a nice guy and gave the individual the password I used to register. So guess what - GP came back with no rebate because the registered names were different. I'll just have to make do with the $$ I sold G3 for. Can't really complain as I'd have gone with G4 even without the incentive.

[jeffpn]

Doug, I did exactly what you did: I unregistered my G3 and gave it to my friend (as a bonus since I owed him nothing, but that's another story). When GP checked the registered name, it was my friends name, not mine, and they returned the rebate forms and things, no rebate. I sent them a letter explaining all of the RF software I've bought in the past, including my explanation as to why the serial that used to be registered to me no longer is, and the original rebate forms, and they did send me a check.

[dhk79]

Thanks Jeff, but I tossed the returned paperwork some time ago and decided not to sweat the small stuff. After all, with what I spend on this "hobby" the rebate was just a drop in the bucket.

Doug

[jeffpn]

That's okay, I bet you're next in line to get paid by KE, anyway! ;) :D

[pplace]

That's okay, I bet you're next in line to get paid by KE, anyway! ;) :D

Doug told me what he does (to earn his money) in the past......I'm assuming he won't be leaving that for a position at KE! ;) Unless of course they offer "at home" positions in your free time?!

Edit: If anything Doug should look into teaching kindergarten. He has the temper (or lack of) to handle that. I know this for a fact....as well as he put up with my hounding, non stop questions, e-mails etc....he never was put on that he was frustrated or irritated with anything. All around, he really is a great guy and a class act.

[jeffpn]

Freelance, baby!!! That's what I meant!!!

[dhk79]

Thanks guys, but let's cool it ok. This is getting a bit embarrassing.

[jeffpn]

Don't worry about it, Doug. You'll still be able to go to the mall without being recognized, I promise. No sunglasses necessary!!! ;)