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abaser
11-29-2011, 08:44 PM
For my second request, Ill be attempting the Lockheed 10e Electra flown by Amelia Earhart. While my internet has been down, Ive had some time to get started a little bit. I hope I can do this one justice.

Boof69
11-29-2011, 08:52 PM
I thought this one had farings. Well maybe that tut will come in handy another time. :)

abaser
11-29-2011, 08:56 PM
Its just a start. I haven't been up and running long enough to go through your tut yet. I haven't even cut the wings or tail off yet.

Boof69
11-29-2011, 09:01 PM
If your wings are done you won't need the tut.

andy29847
11-29-2011, 09:09 PM
I love the old twins.

abaser
11-29-2011, 09:13 PM
They're not done yet. I'm not happy with how the trailing edge turned out. They will be redone.

abaser
11-29-2011, 09:24 PM
I love the old twins.
I'll give you my opinio on them when I'm done building it :p

Maj. Numbskully
11-29-2011, 09:38 PM
This ones been long overdue..
and I again wanna thank you for taking it on.
I think you'll do just fine andy .................take your time
its looking real good even at this early stage :D

abaser
11-29-2011, 09:42 PM
Keep your eyes on it. If at any time you see I did or didn't do something that's not accurate, chime in. I'm not familiar with this one and theres several variations it seems.

Maj. Numbskully
11-29-2011, 09:48 PM
I will ...........its your baby ....but my grandchild ;)

Boof69
11-29-2011, 09:52 PM
Andy. Who's your daddy? :p

abaser
11-29-2011, 09:57 PM
Ill never tell. :p

Boof69
11-29-2011, 10:01 PM
The Maj's comment suggests you and he are related. ;)

abaser
11-29-2011, 10:09 PM
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: ...................... :p

abaser
11-30-2011, 12:11 AM
Well, you guys ready? Here I go. First of all, I put the fairings on the wing root and cut the wing off. That led me to discover this little area. Due to the shape of the root, I have this funky face that materializes from the cut. Normally, I would connect the front and rear verts (for mapping purposes) and then the top and bottom verts to define the shape of this face. However, due to the shape of the wing, I have more on top than on the bottom.

My first thought is to add verts to the bottom to compensate for the difference, but since this area will only be visible after a crash, and probably still wont be seen, is this a necessary step? Im not concerned with polys right now, but if I was, and I start adding verts, I will also add polys due to the triangulation, correct? And, If I add the verts, do I go ahead and add the edges running the length of the wing?

Boof69
11-30-2011, 01:25 AM
That poly will be fixed once you make some connections from the top verts on the wing and the bottom verts. Whatever you do subtract edge loops from the top instead adding to the bottom.

jeffpn
11-30-2011, 07:23 AM
This is how I would do it. Connect the verts with the red lines first. Then for mapping, use the menu Connect command to place the green edge. Don't add any more verts.

abaser
11-30-2011, 02:42 PM
A little lunchtime progress.

abaser
12-01-2011, 03:00 AM
A few more details. Im thinking about adding scale looking prop hubs so I roughed these in to get a feel for it. Ive also got a start on the gear, that I can only find one good pic of. Im sitting in at 5454 polies at the moment.

If anyone knows of any similar landing gear that I can find good reference pics of, please let me know. Im working off of one descent back shot of the gear, but I cant tell exactly how it works, and some of the structure is unclear. :(

Lastly, does the cutout in the back of the nacelle look correct for this style of plane?

abaser
12-02-2011, 07:35 PM
Halfway done with the landing gear.

abaser
12-04-2011, 05:22 PM
Hey Maj., before I start cutting up my nacelles, how does this look to you? Seems about right from my end, but thats just me.

flexible
12-04-2011, 05:48 PM
The picture you posted, shows the finders round on the corners.

U-Bird
12-04-2011, 06:04 PM
Compare, looks pretty close

abaser
12-04-2011, 06:25 PM
Compare, looks pretty close
Do you know how long Ive been looking for a shot like this?

abaser
12-04-2011, 06:27 PM
The picture you posted, shows the finders round on the corners.
They are now rounded ;)

U-Bird
12-04-2011, 07:15 PM
Glad to have been of help. Not many of those bird left in this world.

abaser
12-04-2011, 07:17 PM
According to a video I watched on it, theres only 1 10E left in existence. Only 15 were ever made to begin with.

U-Bird
12-04-2011, 09:19 PM
Yup,..... purty scarce, don't get to se em at air shows

Maj. Numbskully
12-04-2011, 09:25 PM
andy , andy ,andy...............I sent you one thats similar in the original package :rolleyes: :p
louking guood Lucy

abaser
12-04-2011, 09:27 PM
Yes you did. However, I can see how to cut out the wells in his :D

Its just a closer shot, thats all.

Maj. Numbskully
12-04-2011, 09:28 PM
humpf !

abaser
12-04-2011, 11:49 PM
Umm........I can't figure it out :o How do I do dis?

abaser
12-05-2011, 12:07 AM
Ok, Ive got this much, but Im sure someone will probably tell me why this wont work. I extracted the bottom face. I then "lifted" the original bottom face, pivoting the face on the trailing edge of the wing, into the wing, then moved the extracted face back into place. If this will work, Ill add thickness and the ridges to the newly formed flap.

abaser
12-07-2011, 01:15 AM
This area has been a living nightmare for me, and Im sure I took the long way around about doing it, but it's done.

Maj. Numbskully
12-07-2011, 01:27 AM
NICE :eek: :D

abaser
12-07-2011, 08:43 AM
So you likey??? :p Thought you might. polies at the moment 8726. Before I start thinking about the interior, Are you wanting the cockpit alone, or, if polies allow do you want the cargo bay as well? I ask because it determines how I do the rear windows (which I will leave until near the end if you want a bay).

Maj. Numbskully
12-07-2011, 07:10 PM
If they'd be visible .....
There were Custom built fuel tanks directly behind the cock pit
those would be cool if polys allow

abaser
12-07-2011, 07:14 PM
Keep your fingers crossed. If I've got em, ill add em. ;)

Maj. Numbskully
12-07-2011, 08:11 PM
cool
I think I can even bump in the distorted aluminum as shown in the tank nearest the camera

abaser
12-08-2011, 09:20 AM
HELLOO ello ello! :p

abaser
12-09-2011, 09:54 AM
Before and after transparency shots of my windows. Then I removed the fuse just to see what was going on, but theres nothing there. The windows are separate pieces from the fuse right now.

abaser
12-11-2011, 11:19 PM
Im getting started on the IP and cockpit area, but there are very few pics that I have found showing that area. This is probably the best that I have. I admit I have practically no knowledge of how a real aircraft is put together, so I ask you guys. Anyone have a clue as to how the yolk (I guess thats what its called :o ) is routed on the left and right sides of the cockpit? I assume it would go down towards the floor, or maybe into the IP, but I want to make sure before I attempt it.

Kmot
12-11-2011, 11:40 PM
Here's a couple more....

Norton
12-11-2011, 11:45 PM
Here's a couple shots and a nice R/C pic.

abaser
12-11-2011, 11:50 PM
Wow! Thanks guys! Ive gotta learn to Google better :o

jeffpn
12-12-2011, 07:20 AM
Anyone have a clue as to how the yolk (I guess thats what its called :o ) is routed on the left and right sides of the cockpit?
Um, that's an egg part, not an aircraft part! :p The word you are looking for is 'yoke'.

td9cowboy
12-12-2011, 10:08 AM
Great catch Jeff!! That's just unforgivable!! :mad: :rolleyes:

abaser
12-12-2011, 11:31 AM
Funny, the guy who admits his ignorance is the one that gets picked on :p

jeffpn
12-12-2011, 11:35 AM
Yeah, but you got skin like rawhide!!

td9cowboy
12-12-2011, 02:05 PM
Actually jeff, I thought abaser was quite observant to notice that left over breakfast on that yoke. :cool:

td9cowboy
12-12-2011, 02:23 PM
Cessna's just have a shaft that goes straight into the dash. I don't think one in a million would call you out on it if you wanted to save a few polies'

jeffpn
12-12-2011, 02:29 PM
I guess that makes me one in a billion?! :p

Maj. Numbskully
12-12-2011, 02:44 PM
Actually the yokes seem very similar to the Sparton Executive's.

td9cowboy
12-12-2011, 02:45 PM
Here Andy. Use this for your wallpaper and stick it through the dash! :D

abaser
12-12-2011, 02:59 PM
Ok, ok........"yokes" on me. Sheesh, see if I trust my spell check again. :p

brields
12-12-2011, 06:10 PM
Cessna's just have a shaft that goes straight into the dash. I don't think one in a million would call you out on it if you wanted to save a few polies'

I guess that makes me one in a billion?! :p

this makes us two in two billion.

jeffpn
12-12-2011, 06:27 PM
Yep, me and you are toopeezinapod. :rolleyes:

Maj. Numbskully
12-12-2011, 07:45 PM
toopeezinapod
I've always wanted to go there
eastern Ukraine isn't it?

abaser
12-14-2011, 12:59 AM
Sorry td9, couldn't make myself stick em through the dash.

There's much refining to do, but it's a rough start.

abaser
12-16-2011, 12:47 AM
Tanks are in place. I havent had much time the past couple of days, so there is very little progress, but things ARE going better than I expected poly wise. Currently she sets at 11350. Surprisingly, I was able to keep this one just under the 8k poly limit before starting the interior :eek: ........my best effort yet. :)

jeffpn
12-16-2011, 07:17 AM
Are you going to fuse the nacelle to the wing, or leave them separate?

abaser
12-16-2011, 07:51 AM
I tried fusing it once, with bad results. I decided to keep moving on and come back to it. I just havent made it back yet. :p But yes, I plan for them to be fused.

jeffpn
12-16-2011, 08:19 AM
You don't have to fuse it. It does make the CS a bit easier if you do.

abaser
12-16-2011, 03:09 PM
Here ya go Maj. Tanks are in, strapped, and full of fuel :D

Now, time to go over things to see where I can lose polys. Im now at 16944, with things to add, and not much room to play with.

Maj. Numbskully
12-18-2011, 07:46 PM
:eek: :eek: FREAKING Amazing looking andy !!!!! :D :D

abaser
12-18-2011, 07:49 PM
:o :o :o

abaser
12-31-2011, 12:48 AM
Hehehe..............Doesn't this look nice :D Too bad the polys aren't there :(

21100 polys with modified radials, down from 32000.

Maj. Numbskully
12-31-2011, 12:54 AM
not bad............ for an Amateur

:p ;)

abaser
12-31-2011, 09:43 AM
Well, Id love to take the credit, but I stole the motors from wilsonman from the repository..............................shhhhhhh, dont tell him :p :p :p

abaser
12-31-2011, 07:30 PM
OK Maj., I think Im calling this the final product. I've got the two radials and I managed to keep the front of the 5 fuel tanks as well as the left and right side tanks. With all of that, Im at 17480 polys.

With that being said, if you give the go ahead, I'll start baking and mapping my little heart out................but not tonight :p :D

Happy New Year to you guys!!!

abaser
01-03-2012, 06:16 PM
After battling stretching issues, I think Ive about got this mapping thing figured out :D

Maj., this is about as good as it gets with me behind the mouse.

And no, parts are not sized or aligned yet ;)

Boof69
01-03-2012, 06:26 PM
How much better do you want it to get? I think the mapping is looking good.

cphannaford
01-03-2012, 08:38 PM
You guys are amazing! It is really interesting to read how you guys build these planes. I had no idea how much work you put into making these awesome works of art. Thanks for doing this for the rest of us to enjoy. Keep them coming.

Chris

jeffpn
01-03-2012, 08:47 PM
Turn around, Chris! It'll suck you in, too!!! :eek:

Maj. Numbskully
01-03-2012, 10:04 PM
Ya looks good to me !

abaser
01-03-2012, 10:06 PM
You guys are amazing! It is really interesting to read how you guys build these planes. I had no idea how much work you put into making these awesome works of art. Thanks for doing this for the rest of us to enjoy. Keep them coming.

Chris
First off, thanks. We try ;)

Secondly, take Jeff's advise, turn and run! It starts off as interest in reading how these models are made. Before you know it, your glued to the computer, going through tuts, with a 10 o'clock forest, and refusing to sleep. It's an addiction that compares to a crack addiction..............for me at least :p

abaser
01-03-2012, 10:07 PM
Ya looks good to me !
Glad to hear it ;)

abaser
01-13-2012, 12:11 AM
Well, Im getting sidetracked too much lately, but Ive managed to get real close to getting things ready to paint :) Man this thing has a ton of parts :p

abaser
01-13-2012, 02:59 PM
I noticed these black areas last night after taking the screenys I posted. The last time I saw this, it was due to a face that I holed. Once I undid the hole, the spots went away. I thought that took care of the issue, but maybe not. :confused: It's been a few days since I really did anything with this, so I can't remember if I added any holes or not. If this is truly a problem with a hole, is there a way to track down the face it is linked to without manually undoing each and every hole until its gone?

EDIT: When I separate my parts, they go away. Combine and it comes back. I tried a cleanup and welding with no luck.

jeffpn
01-13-2012, 03:23 PM
Send it!

abaser
01-15-2012, 12:06 AM
Cmesh................................check
Mapping.............................check
.tga created.......................check
pile of pulled out hair.........check
exported 3ds.....................check
polys under 20000.............check (18204)
Off to Blender....................wish me luck :p

Maj. Numbskully
01-15-2012, 12:08 AM
Good Luck :D

http://www.drpistone.com/Medical-Hair-Restoration/Hair-Restoration/
:p

jeffpn
01-15-2012, 12:37 AM
Good luck, Daniel-son!

andy29847
01-15-2012, 01:59 AM
The Lockheed 10 was the first plane that Kelly Johnson, later to be the leader of the Lockheed Skunk Works (U-2, SR-71), worked on as a professional engineer.

From Wiki:
At the University of Michigan, he conducted wind tunnel tests of Lockheed's proposed twin-engined Lockheed Model 10 Electra airliner. He found that the aircraft did not have adequate directional stability, but his professor felt it did and reported so to Lockheed. Upon completing his master's degree in 1933, Johnson joined the Lockheed Company as a tool designer at a salary of $83 a month. Shortly after starting at Lockheed, Johnson convinced Hall Hibbard, the chief engineer, that the Lockheed Model 10 Electra was unstable. Hibbard sent Johnson back to Michigan to conduct more tests. Johnson eventually made multiple changes to the wind tunnel model, including adding a "H" tail, to address the problem. Lockheed accepted Johnson's suggestions and the Model 10 went on to be a success. This brought Johnson to the attention of Lockheed management, and he was promoted to aeronautical engineer.[5

abaser
01-19-2012, 10:33 PM
HEY MAJ!!!!!

With modeled engines and all :D :D :D

jeffpn
01-19-2012, 11:01 PM
Cool!

Maj. Numbskully
01-19-2012, 11:19 PM
Sweeeeeet ! :D
wait a minute................. you got 6 ?

abaser
01-19-2012, 11:50 PM
Yup. Here's a couple more :D

Boof69
01-20-2012, 01:17 AM
Looks great Andy!

abaser
02-06-2013, 01:16 AM
Ok, Im self diagnosing myself with ADD. Ive begun to work on yet another model.......well, revisiting an old model. With more experience, I think I can remake this one, possibly with fewer polys than before so I can keep the full cargo bay (which I still have the tanks in another file). I feel the tanks will most likely be the only thing to survive the initial build since I was never really happy with the way the rest of it turned out. Anyway, here are a few side by side comparisons of the original and my work tonight.

abaser
02-06-2013, 08:33 AM
With about 15 minutes to spare this morning, I got the wings roughed in. 812 polys so far. Much better than the 3008 I was at last time at this point.

jeffpn
02-06-2013, 09:04 AM
So what happened to the other polies? :p

abaser
02-06-2013, 09:12 AM
Experience? That and the file I still have is a blender bring back. The geometry is all over the place. I'm really hoping my original attempt wasn't really that high. I guess i should actually look back through this thread to see if I posted a poly count at this point, huh.:p

Maj. Numbskully
02-07-2013, 09:26 PM
Glad to see this one back in the rotation..............is there anything you need?...did you find those ref. shots we talked about?

abaser
02-07-2013, 10:16 PM
If you don't mind sending what you have, I'd appreciate it. Especially the interior shots. I've made some progress, but can't post pics until I get back home.

Madratter
02-07-2013, 10:23 PM
Amelia!

abaser
02-07-2013, 11:29 PM
I been busy lately!!:p 14482 polys currently. :D:D:D:D

Ok, ok.........so the interior was brought in from another file, and maybe the nacelles too............OK!! You caught me! I found a good file from before that I am actually pleased with except a few minor details.:p I've got some rework to do around the window area to prevent shading, and if you notice, the V stabs and rudders have been removed, and most likely the H stab will be as well. It's extremely thick looking to me, but then again, maybe the real deal was as well. I dont really know at the moment because Ive lost all of my reference pics. I'll be digging in Google as soon as I finish this post.

Madratter
02-07-2013, 11:51 PM
Wow. Huge progress for two days.

Boof69
02-07-2013, 11:53 PM
I see your skills are getting very sharp. You are fitting in a lot of detail in very short periods of time. Looks good.http://www.helifreak.com/images/smilies/thumbup.gif

abaser
02-07-2013, 11:56 PM
Ummmmmm.............did you guys read my post?:p Its an old file I'm modifying. Just cleaning it up a bit.:p

Boof69
02-07-2013, 11:58 PM
I guess I was wrong?:confused: It looks good though.:)

abaser
02-07-2013, 11:59 PM
:p:p Don't get me wrong. I appreciate the compliment. And yes, things are coming easy to adjust from the mess I had before.

Boof69
02-08-2013, 12:02 AM
I know you do. No worries.:)

abaser
02-08-2013, 12:06 AM
I do have a question though. Take a look at my prop hubs. What is the realty of getting a prop to actually match up with them? I figure its slim to none, so unless someone knows something I don't, they'll most likely be replaced with generic spinners in order to save polys.

Boof69
02-08-2013, 12:13 AM
I used a similar prop hub on one of my models. I just went back and forth between RF and Max until the hub was rotated and scaled correctly with the prop. After you complete the physics however. You will want to have the final prop size set first.

abaser
02-09-2013, 04:08 PM
Well, Here are a few progress pics. Not much in the line of visual additions, just mainly refining geometry to allow the addition of the modeled radials. I never dreamed I could do it with the tanks in the back and all other details inside the cockpit, but I think I have accomplished just that. Im still debating the H stab remake, and Im positive I could remake it with less polys, but if it's fairly accurate I dont see the point at the moment.

Anyway, here are a few pics and quick default setting renders. Current poly count is 17578.

Maj. Numbskully
02-09-2013, 07:39 PM
Looks great ..the tanks/cockpit look awesome
Liking the way you did the radials too
looking forward to this one:D

abaser
02-09-2013, 10:20 PM
Ok Maj., Unless you see something that needs tending to, I think Im going to call it good, and start mapping. Here are some shots of the interior for your looking pleasures.

A couple questions before I get to mapping though. Levers, yokes, tanks/plumbing for tanks, and pedals.....map or bake?

Other than the IP, do you have any other special requests on sizing of parts?

jeffpn
02-09-2013, 10:24 PM
Other than the IP, do you have any other special requests on sizing of parts?Not right now, but he'll change his mind later!! :p :D

Flare
02-10-2013, 12:53 PM
Nice cockpit detailing!

Maj. Numbskully
02-10-2013, 01:06 PM
jeff knows me so well !

bake ......levers, pedals . yokes, ...

map the tanks If you have the space.

beautiful modeling job andy

Fly_electric
02-11-2013, 01:36 AM
Excellent work Andy!