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Fly_electric
07-14-2015, 10:10 PM
Next up is a request: the Sig Morrisey Bravo

Put in a little work on this a while back.

Still in the early stages.

Carkshark
07-14-2015, 10:35 PM
I saw when this was requested... dang it fly, you beat me to it.

doug schluter
07-15-2015, 12:31 AM
gotta love the Morrisey Bravo 8)

Fly_electric
07-19-2015, 11:15 PM
A little more work on the tail feathers and wing this weekend.

technoid
07-20-2015, 12:05 AM
Very cool.. looks great!

doug schluter
07-20-2015, 10:07 PM
FE it's looking like a Morrisey Bravo what gives 8)

Carkshark
07-20-2015, 11:00 PM
Very nice renders.

Fly_electric
07-22-2015, 12:48 AM
Thanks guys.

Fly_electric
07-24-2015, 12:47 AM
LG and wheel pants are in.
More work to go on the tail gear though.

Fly_electric
07-24-2015, 09:33 AM
Proper credit:

The non reflective floor used in some of the renders are courtesy of the quality work by Abaser. Thanks Andy.
Was unknowingly missing the concrete texture all this time. :o

doug schluter
07-24-2015, 09:44 AM
looking excellent FE nice LG and pants

technoid
07-24-2015, 10:16 AM
Very cool pictures. Great progress.

Carkshark
07-24-2015, 10:58 AM
Get some pants on that bird!!!! :P

abaser
07-24-2015, 11:02 AM
Looking good FE. Just an observation here, but is that shading around the wing saddle just SG related?

Fly_electric
07-24-2015, 11:51 AM
Thanks guys.

Andy,
Probably part of the typical price from the wing saddle cutout.
Item #2,455 of things to correct. :)

Fly_electric
07-25-2015, 10:16 AM
Andy's correct observation seemed like a good time to explain what some of the issues that can cause such shading/distortions and how they can be corrected.

Auto smoothing works very well and is handy in the early stages of a build, but as Boof has correctly mentioned in his tutorial, there are rules that have to be obeyed for the best results.

There is also a comment on cleaning up the excessive verts that usually result from using the boolean cutting tool. Another handy tool, but remember "clean up" is required.

Fly_electric
07-25-2015, 10:25 AM
A few more.

Note:
There will be a modeled prop attachment screw head in the spinner.
Auto SG'd at this stage, but when it is later placed in its own SG, the proper distinctive edge will be shown. Another example of the power of manually use of smoothing groups.

Carkshark
07-25-2015, 12:32 PM
You explained this very well. Nice!

Fly_electric
07-26-2015, 03:44 PM
Thanks Carkshark.

technoid
07-26-2015, 04:35 PM
Good stuff.. keep it coming!

doug schluter
07-26-2015, 10:29 PM
i'm really liking the Bravo , he was teasing again , he has it flying in RF hahaha

Fly_electric
07-28-2015, 12:45 AM
A little more progress:
Control horns, push rods and first pass at a tail wheel with shock absorbing springs.

Getting ever closer to mapping..

doug schluter
07-28-2015, 01:44 AM
woohoo springy tail wheel steering connections sweet 8)

technoid
07-28-2015, 08:40 AM
Very nice, are the controls going to be animated?

Fly_electric
07-29-2015, 07:56 AM
Very nice, are the controls going to be animated?

Absolutely!

cap580
07-29-2015, 09:47 AM
Awesome job man! Can't wait for it to be released.

technoid
07-29-2015, 11:01 AM
Absolutely!

Cool!

doug schluter
07-29-2015, 01:01 PM
sweet , animated controls excellent FE

Fly_electric
08-05-2015, 03:01 AM
Update:

1. Reworked the tail wheel spring a bit-- didn't look quite right
2. Flaps added
3. Cowl reworked
4. Added lens covers for the wing navigation lights
5. Work started on a pilot

The plan is to add one of Flex's engines, and with the total still under 20K, there is still a chance of that happening..

doug schluter
08-05-2015, 10:04 AM
looking good FE

technoid
08-05-2015, 11:52 PM
Very very nice.. keep it coming!

Carkshark
08-06-2015, 01:42 AM
Impressive!

Fly_electric
08-07-2015, 09:33 PM
Thanks guys.

Fly_electric
08-07-2015, 09:36 PM
Encountered a couple of mistakes during this build and thought I'd share what was found and their solution.

The first is fixing a bad pivot. In the example shown, I'm not sure how it got that way, but it was mirrored from right to left in this particular case (not the usual practice).
As shown, the transform reset (on the object only) cured the error.


The second was a distorted shape when rotating the part. In the second example, the aileron PR was copied to make the flap PR.
The problem was that the PR had a link to the control horn, and deleting the link before making a new copy fixed it.
In preparing this help note, performing a local rotation with a parenting link present shows the same error.


Having said that, when copying or mirroring parts it is a good practice to:

1. Remove all links.
2. Perform the copy/mirror on one part at a time.
For example, if the ailerons and wing are both mirrored, the copied aileron might have some weird pivoting.
Now the transform reset may work on that pivot error, but it is usually rather easy to recopy/remirror from the single, unlinked source part.


Others with more experience please feel free to add your comments/corrections.
These were just some recently solved errors that are offered as help to other custom content creators.

Fly_electric
08-07-2015, 09:38 PM
A little more (the typos are free of charge :o )

Carkshark
08-07-2015, 11:46 PM
Very well explained FE, I encountered all of these same issues with my hurricane.

abaser
08-08-2015, 12:25 AM
Well, if you can ever figure THIS (http://www.knifeedge.com/forums/showpost.php?p=247006&postcount=254) one out, let me know. I still to this day have an issue with the wheels on this model going crazy. I am convinced it's something corrupt in the max file. Probably happened in the transfer from blunder to max.

Boof69
08-08-2015, 08:55 AM
The fix I use for a difficult pivot is to create a box, convert it to an editable poly, click attach then click on the part of interest. Then click on the element tool and select the box and delete it. Now go to the hierarchy tab and affect pivot only, then center to object. You now have a pivot that is oriented to the world and will not deform the part. From there I type in the same rotational values as the original part making them negative values where necessary. This pivot issue has plagued Max since it's birth.

Fly_electric
08-25-2015, 12:41 AM
Update:

Have added the C-Meshes, to get a better idea how many triangles will be available for an engine (the new plan is to model a Tartan Twin). There are now about 2300 available. Also wanted to get most of the mapping out of the way (our "favorite" task...)
So of late it has been:
1. do some mapping
2. go to step 1...........

doug schluter
08-25-2015, 10:21 AM
nice progress FE looks good i don't see any stretching on the mapping 8)

Fly_electric
08-26-2015, 08:44 PM
Thank Doug.

Am actually using two new mapping techniques to me on this plane, taking advantage of the relax engine in max.

1. The relax engine works well with nice uniform shapes. So, the wheel pants were mapped & relaxed as one object. Then, with the mapping locked in, the cutout for the wheel was made. The mapping remains good, right up to the corners.

2. I've switched as much as is practical to mapping a fuselage in two halves. The SMB has several corners in its profile that would make trying to map in one shot a bit difficult. So, have mapped the areas that lend themselves well to relaxing on a given axis, and then welding the intersecting verts together. The relax engine takes care of the bulk of the work to make a good map, followed by a little bit of stretch adjustments at the intersection.

doug schluter
08-26-2015, 09:26 PM
sure looks like it is working for you from the pictures FE , makes any extra CS work good to go

Carkshark
08-28-2015, 11:03 PM
That does sound easier than what I did for the Acro Sport. Hopefully I can get to it soon.

Fly_electric
08-29-2015, 01:12 AM
Was home today, so work was started on the Tartan 77.
1226 triangles so far.

Will try to model the fins if possible, but they may end up just getting bump mapped.

technoid
08-29-2015, 06:54 PM
Was home today, so work was started on the Tartan 77.
1226 triangles so far.

Will try to model the fins if possible, but they may end up just getting bump mapped.

Are you trying to keep it down for RF 6.5 or is the plane triangle count just going beyond 27k maybe? The OS IL-300 I did was 11,595 triangles so that's a big hit on anything I put it in. I went back and cut everything I could out of it but there's just a lot of parts in it and I was going for detail. Good luck hopefully you'll be able to add the fins, but sometimes you have to scale back too.

doug schluter
08-29-2015, 08:50 PM
looking really good FE 8)

Fly_electric
08-31-2015, 01:27 PM
Thank Doug. The 3 views are good for an overall guide, but are also rather low resolution. So, am "guesstimating" a bit using some of the higher resolution pictures available on the 'net. For example, the carb section isn't too clear in the 3 views, but pictures like these help.


technoid:

Yes, I'm staying at the 20K limit to support those 6.5 users who do not have 7.x for whatever reason(s). With what has been built for the SMB & pilot, am budgeting ~2k for the Tartan to bring the total within 20k.
As to fins, the best polygon reduction technique has been shared on the forum some time ago: make them long narrow triangles with the outside edge one edge, vs a polygon. Repeat for the fin base. Thus, in cross section, they have a saw tooth waveform look. If however, one has the polygons to spare, then by all means fully model the fins.

Fly_electric
09-13-2015, 10:42 PM
Finally put some time into the Tartan Twin 77 again.

Several areas on the air scoop were not quite correct, so those were redone.

Also added:
Air scoop:
- mounting screws and supports that are part of the carb
- the arm for the air scoop interior mechanics
Carb:
- throttle arm
- raised front plate and its mounting screws

uncle twist
09-13-2015, 11:34 PM
That`s sweet looking FE, can`t wait to see the finished engine, I would love to get back at modeling, just can`t do it these days..:(

doug schluter
09-13-2015, 11:59 PM
nice work FE this will be one sweet looking Sig Morrisey Bravo

technoid
09-14-2015, 02:53 AM
Very nice keep up the good work, can't wait for the finished plane.

Fly_electric
09-15-2015, 12:20 AM
Thanks guys.

Fly_electric
09-16-2015, 02:43 PM
A little fin work added. Total triangles are a wee bit over the limit, but so far it looks like the fins may be able to stay..

doug schluter
09-16-2015, 06:33 PM
man that sure is looking good FE , it will add to the SMB's detail nicely , i'm saving all the pics in a folder of this build

technoid
09-16-2015, 07:34 PM
Oh yeah... keep 'em!

Fly_electric
09-16-2015, 10:57 PM
Some better renders.

doug schluter
09-16-2015, 11:04 PM
i'm keep "em" 8D

Fly_electric
09-24-2015, 12:08 AM
A little more in progress detail: exhaust pipes and throttle push rod.
The structure inside the air scoop may get deleted as triangles are needed. I have been told it is a choke valve, and although it looks like it could be linked to the throttle arm it is apparently not.

technoid
09-24-2015, 01:29 AM
Very good keep going I'm ready for that guy!

doug schluter
09-24-2015, 11:49 AM
Very good keep going I'm ready for that guy!

yes me too , looks really good FE

Fly_electric
09-25-2015, 07:53 PM
Thanks guys.

Teaser:
A quick test fit...

Ron6234
09-25-2015, 08:27 PM
Looks great, I can't wait to see it on the swap's. Nice job FE
Ron

doug schluter
09-25-2015, 09:49 PM
it's getting closer FE you have it looking excellent

Fly_electric
10-01-2015, 01:40 AM
Added:
Cutouts of the fins for the exhaust manifolds, ignition cables, and head bolts.
And then the cables themselves.

Was then time for another test fit (the TT77 is a separate max project). That showed the cables will have to get some more bends in them to better route into the firewall... :o

Custom content disclaimer:
Have not looked at the SMB plans recently, so it is rather likely the engine is not quite scaled correctly...:rolleyes:

uncle twist
10-01-2015, 02:04 AM
F. E., That plane looks fantastic, the engine is no less than incredible, great work..:D

12oclockhigh
10-01-2015, 10:20 AM
A couple of photos of the real thing.

doug schluter
10-01-2015, 11:18 AM
F. E., That plane looks fantastic, the engine is no less than incredible, great work..:D

i agree uncle twist FE has the SMB looking top notch , well worth the wait on this EA

technoid
10-01-2015, 12:06 PM
Very cool beautiful work!

Fly_electric
10-01-2015, 12:59 PM
Thanks guys.

12oclockhigh:
Thanks. Great pictures. The engine being modeled is a Tartan Twin 77.

12oclockhigh
10-01-2015, 01:22 PM
Sorry, I did not mean to say anything except here is another example. Probably the coolest engine that I have owned to-date. I plan to put it on an RC Guys Ag Wagon. (Cessna 188B)

Fly_electric
10-02-2015, 09:52 PM
No problem. Post some pictures of that install if possible!

Carkshark
10-08-2015, 01:11 AM
Wow, this build has really progressed since my last look at it during the summer.

Fly_electric
10-12-2015, 07:19 PM
Thanks Carkshark.

Fly_electric
10-12-2015, 10:44 PM
Call to airfoil experts

The plans state the airfoil on the Sig Morrisey Bravo is a NACA 43015.
RF does not have that in the data base they use.
Nor have I (as of yet) found any data on that airfoil.

So to those who have airfoil characteristic knowledge, what is the closest match from those that are available?

Thanks

uncle twist
10-12-2015, 11:54 PM
Is it possible that you can provide a broader pic. of the airfoil that are in the plans.???, I have found (looking at airfoils in RF)that they don`t vary to much from a # that is close to another #, in other words, if there`s a # close to NACA 43015 in the RF editor, you could probably use it.

doug schluter
10-13-2015, 04:22 PM
Call to airfoil experts

The plans state the airfoil on the Sig Morrisey Bravo is a NACA 43015.
RF does not have that in the data base they use.
Nor have I (as of yet) found any data on that airfoil.

So to those who have airfoil characteristic knowledge, what is the closest match from those that are available?

Thanks

FE i went through the airfoils in RF editor and came up with a list that may help you pick a close enough one to work on the SMB .
NACA 0013 to 0016 , NACA M12 , NPL 9627 , ONERA NACA CAMBRE , RAF 48 ,

S8036(16 percent ) , S8037 ( 16 Percent )

csgill75
10-13-2015, 04:29 PM
searching for the NACA 43015 brings up BOEING VERTOL V43015-2.48 which is in Realflight as a usable airfoil. perhaps you could use that. It is the Only Airfoil with 43015 that I see on the Airfoil tools
site (http://airfoiltools.com/search/index)

http://airfoiltools.com/images/airfoil/v43015-il_m.png

csgill75
10-13-2015, 05:34 PM
Check out this site (https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/mitchellwing/conversations/topics/685), they talk about a few airfoils and the 23015 airfoil is similar.

http://airfoiltools.com/images/airfoil/naca23015-il_m.png

doug schluter
10-13-2015, 09:30 PM
Check out this site (https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/mitchellwing/conversations/topics/685), they talk about a few airfoils and the 23015 airfoil is similar.

http://airfoiltools.com/images/airfoil/naca23015-il_m.png

this one looks really close csgill75

technoid
10-13-2015, 10:47 PM
I'm curious about airfoils in RF, how much difference would you expect from an airfoil that's 'sort of' like the correct airfoil than one that 'is the correct' airfoil'? Put differently do you think RF accurately models airfoils. I played with different airfoils a while back but they all seemed the same. I don't remember the ones I tried but it was about 4 different ones.

Here's another question that's been on my mind for a while, sorry it's not about airfoils, but I just thought of it so I'll ask. It seems to me that when the plane is moving toward the ground and normally you'd have no trouble giving it a small amount of up elevator and it would curve up slightly and get close but definitely not hit the ground. But often in that situation in RF the plane seems to be pulled into the ground. Is it just me or has anyone else noticed that?

uncle twist
10-14-2015, 12:11 AM
In regards to the second half of your question, I`ve never had that happen, UNLESS, I was inverted with maybe a little to much libation...:)

uncle twist
10-14-2015, 12:18 AM
As for the airfoils, I would`nd expect to see to much difference between ones that are similar, but if you compare two that are completely different on the same plane, you will notice a difference, as I as well have played with them..;)

csgill75
10-14-2015, 05:31 AM
Myself and others used to race each other on custom tracks and the rules were simple, you could use any airplane and modify anything except for the motor had to be a certain motor and the scale had to be similar. The key to speed was choosing the correct airfoil and reducing drag. We got really good with the editor. What keep us honest was we all had to post our model for everyone else to download and use. it was a ton of fun. The differences between airfoils are subtle but there are differences between each of them. Some differences between two similar airfoils are just 4-5 mph..

technoid
10-14-2015, 05:55 AM
In regards to the second half of your question, I`ve never had that happen, UNLESS, I was inverted with maybe a little to much libation...:)

HA... Yeah it's probably just my bad flying.

technoid
10-14-2015, 06:00 AM
Thanks for the answers on airfoils. Sometimes I'm not good at detecting subtle changes so that's probably why I didn't see the difference. I should have picked airfoils that were very different because they were fairly close.

doug schluter
10-14-2015, 10:01 PM
Thanks for the answers on airfoils. Sometimes I'm not good at detecting subtle changes so that's probably why I didn't see the difference. I should have picked airfoils that were very different because they were fairly close.

technoid switch between the symmetrical and change to semi or flat bottom wing cords that will give a huge differences

technoid
10-14-2015, 10:11 PM
technoid switch between the symmetrical and change to semi or flat bottom wing cords that will give a huge differences

Oh yeah... I bet there would be a big difference between symmetrical and flat :) I should play with it again now since I've done it longer, that was way back when I first started.

Fly_electric
10-14-2015, 11:05 PM
Thanks guys for the airfoil info!

Fly_electric
10-14-2015, 11:33 PM
I'm curious about airfoils in RF, how much difference would you expect from an airfoil that's 'sort of' like the correct airfoil than one that 'is the correct' airfoil'? Put differently do you think RF accurately models airfoils. I played with different airfoils a while back but they all seemed the same. I don't remember the ones I tried but it was about 4 different ones.

Here's another question that's been on my mind for a while, sorry it's not about airfoils, but I just thought of it so I'll ask. It seems to me that when the plane is moving toward the ground and normally you'd have no trouble giving it a small amount of up elevator and it would curve up slightly and get close but definitely not hit the ground. But often in that situation in RF the plane seems to be pulled into the ground. Is it just me or has anyone else noticed that?



There can certainly be differences. Beyond just lining up an outline match, it may be useful to pay close attention to the lift and drag drag response relative to the angle of attack for a particular design. You may find rather than just add incidence, an airfoil with some lift at zero incidence might be a better choice.

Pulled into the ground:
The only time I see that is when landing into wind. Nice lift as the plane descends, and then right near the ground (about the height of the plane above the ground), lift significantly disappears and the plane lands hard-- including low wing designs. Would think that might be true for grass as the airflow could be more turbulent. but not on a hard surface like asphalt. Don't know if water landings with wind are similar..

uncle twist
10-15-2015, 02:01 AM
Hey Technoid, in regards to the plane being "pulled" into to the ground, there`s another thing that you might consider, and i`m sure you`ve heard of it, "ground effect", I`ve never really studied it a lot, but i`ve dabbled into it a little. To be honest it confused me pretty much, but I learned the basics of it, you can actually see in action if you know what to look for. It`s like panning for gold, you can see fools golds a thousand times and be fooled as many times thus the name. BUT once you`ve seen the real thing, you`ll never be fooled again, ask me how I know..;). Also , you could be experiencing something as simple as a stall on BOTH wings at the same time, thus, giving the "appearance" of it being pulled to the ground, I`m sure you know in that scenario, the plane will drop like a brick, no left or right tipping of the wings, just a big belly flop.

technoid
10-15-2015, 07:44 AM
Hey Technoid, in regards to the plane being "pulled" into to the ground, there`s another thing that you might consider, and i`m sure you`ve heard of it, "ground effect", I`ve never really studied it a lot, but i`ve dabbled into it a little. To be honest it confused me pretty much, but I learned the basics of it, you can actually see in action if you know what to look for. It`s like panning for gold, you can see fools golds a thousand times and be fooled as many times thus the name. BUT once you`ve seen the real thing, you`ll never be fooled again, ask me how I know..;). Also , you could be experiencing something as simple as a stall on BOTH wings at the same time, thus, giving the "appearance" of it being pulled to the ground, I`m sure you know in that scenario, the plane will drop like a brick, no left or right tipping of the wings, just a big belly flop.

Okay thanks for the info. What I've done in the past, at the field, is do large slow loops right in front of me by adding power going up the loop and dropping power as the loop bottoms out creating a very slow and low to the ground loop. And I could do it over and over with the wheels touching the ground very slightly sometimes. But when I try to duplicate that in RF the plane flys the same as at the field except often it smacks into the ground instead of barely missing it or lightly touching, which has started to seem to me like a physics calculation problem. By that I mean the software knows where I'm at and decides the speed and power isn't sufficient to maintain flight so it creates the crash condition it expects. Thus the pulling into the ground effect I mentioned. Sorry Fly didn't mean to hi-jack your thread.

Fly_electric
10-21-2015, 12:41 AM
No hijack apologies needed technoid. Commenting on how planes are "pulled down" with wind present may be of help to newbie pilots who might be thinking they are doing something wrong.

More work on the Tartan Twin.
Progress:

Added a motor mount
Filled in fins on the rear of the motor (was going to leave them out and save triangles, but they were more visible than I originally thought).
Reworked the ignition cables again (needed to clear the new fins)
Added center hole in the cowl (effected the mapping of course)
Added fuel tubing for exhaust extensions
Changed the exhaust tubes at the bottom (different than the plans, but better match the extensions).

Here are a few test renders of where the SMB is as of now.

Fly_electric
10-21-2015, 12:43 AM
A couple more.

technoid
10-21-2015, 12:56 AM
Beautiful stuff... keep it coming!

uncle twist
10-21-2015, 01:35 AM
FE that plane is looking gorgeous, keep up the great work. Also wanted to add, that your comment to Technoid was very gracious, hijacking used to be a big deal in the threads with some people, sometimes things get off topic. Nice to see that your taking it all in stride, were others may not have. your a good role model for the newcomers to RF..;), as well as some of us old farts..:D

Ron6234
10-21-2015, 12:42 PM
Nice work, she sure looks great FE, looking forward for this one.
Ron

doug schluter
10-21-2015, 04:44 PM
excellent FE you really have the Tartan and the SMB coming together 8D

Fly_electric
10-21-2015, 11:54 PM
Thanks guys.
All the 3d modeling I think is now complete.
It's on to mapping....:)

Things are never this easy, but it would be nice if they were!

uncle twist
10-22-2015, 04:33 AM
Thanks guys.
All the 3d modeling I think is now complete.
It's on to mapping....:)

Things are never this easy, but it would be nice if they were!
Now that`s just "PLANE" funny...;)

Fly_electric
11-04-2015, 12:19 AM
Think everything is mapped (mapping joy #1 ;) )
Now everything needs to be squeezed into the 1x1 (mapping joy #2 ;) )

Also need to go over the main Tartan Twin engine block and adjust the smoothing groups for best edge contrast.

uncle twist
11-04-2015, 12:41 AM
Think everything is mapped (mapping joy #1 ;) )
Now everything needs to be squeezed into the 1x1 (mapping joy #2 ;) )

Also need to go over the main Tartan Twin engine block and adjust the smoothing groups for best edge contrast.
OH JOY, I remember that, (squeezing all the pcs. into the 1x1). it was a challenge for a first timer (me), but didn't turn out to be as hard as I thought it was going to be..:D. I remember reading that someone wrote/etched the lords prayer on a pin head, Now that must have been hard..:eek:

doug schluter
11-04-2015, 11:18 AM
nice FE more progress , that does look like a fun thing to do placing the mapping on the 1x1 .

8D

Fly_electric
12-02-2015, 01:01 AM
Progress has resumed on the SMB. Not too surprising, when getting back to the build I found a few 3d model areas that needed a bit of rework. Should be done with that now, and it is on to the PS'd Monokote & paint. Here are a few renders. The colors are a mix of those from the tga and some temporarily baked on.

Much thanks to Abaser for his generous provision of the concrete texture.

uncle twist
12-02-2015, 02:17 AM
nice FE more progress , that does look like a fun thing to do placing the mapping on the 1x1 .

8D
Doug, it`s not that bad, when you first see the 1x1 in max, it`s a little bit daunting, it is actually 1x1on the monitor, but guess what...you get to enlarge it to full screen, and then all is good, and placing your parts is actually kind of fun, (think brain teaser :D)

uncle twist
12-02-2015, 03:23 AM
Progress has resumed on the SMB. Not too surprising, when getting back to the build I found a few 3d model areas that needed a bit of rework. Should be done with that now, and it is on to the PS'd Monokote & paint. Here are a few renders. The colors are a mix of those from the tga and some temporarily baked on.

Much thanks to Abaser for his generous provision of the concrete texture.
Looking gorgeous there FE..:D

technoid
12-02-2015, 09:53 AM
Very pretty... I want one :)

doug schluter
12-02-2015, 10:39 AM
Doug, it`s not that bad, when you first see the 1x1 in max, it`s a little bit daunting, it is actually 1x1on the monitor, but guess what...you get to enlarge it to full screen, and then all is good, and placing your parts is actually kind of fun, (think brain teaser :D)

yes it looks like the layouts i did on 3" plate steel didn't want to waste any of that back when i was working for a machine shop lots of fabrication and Heavy Duty Mechanic work

doug schluter
12-02-2015, 10:42 AM
you have the SMB really looking sweet FE , your another step closer to done , not to many left then we can fly ,

Fly_electric
12-02-2015, 02:03 PM
Thanks guys.

Fly_electric
12-10-2015, 03:32 AM
A bit more progress.
The error in the 3d model of the fin/rudder has corrected, and a few more CS details have been added.

doug schluter
12-10-2015, 11:18 AM
looking mighty fine FE

12oclockhigh
12-10-2015, 11:39 AM
Looks sweet... pilot a bit pale... very nice work.

abaser
12-10-2015, 11:53 AM
Looks good. I do notice one thing though. Check the cowl front near the intake ports. I'm seeing some shading going on. Either you need more edges, or you've got some open verts.

technoid
12-11-2015, 12:07 AM
Yeah it's looking great. Almost time, eh!

Boof69
12-11-2015, 03:49 PM
Seriously impressed. The force is strong in you.

legoman
12-11-2015, 04:00 PM
Have you decided on a scale and engine yet? Or did I just miss that post?

Fly_electric
12-19-2015, 01:55 AM
Thanks guys.

Doug, technoid: won't be in the store by Christmas, but hopefully in January. Swamped at work these days + the shopping season...
Andy: working on it
12oclock: yeah, just some temporary baked on color with self illumination for renders
Boof: Much thanks. Would never have gotten this far without all of your teaching help a few years ago.
legoman: This is 1/4 scale as it is a model of the limited run Sig kit. Going for the Tartan Twin engine (3d model and physics).

Fly_electric
01-10-2016, 12:51 AM
Had a rare day to spend on the SMB.

Details added:
Corrected the aircraft number
Cowl trim
Cowl mounting bolts
Pilot colors

A little more color work to go, but not too much.
After that are some of the finer details like the usual animating of the push rods and navigation lights.

No IP yet. In keeping with the real world model found on the internet, would like to follow something similar on that.

A few renders:

Fly_electric
01-10-2016, 12:56 AM
A few views from RF.

BTW csgill75, thanks for your suggestion on the airfoil. Made a good improvement over my original choice.

technoid
01-10-2016, 03:10 AM
Very cool the plane is looking great.

doug schluter
01-10-2016, 12:00 PM
looks excellent FE and looks like your having some fun flying it with the new airfoil csgill75 suggested, getting closer , thanks for the update

Fly_electric
01-11-2016, 06:29 AM
Thanks guys.

Carkshark
01-12-2016, 12:52 AM
Your pilot figure looks like the offensive coordinator for the New York Giants! LOL

uncle twist
01-12-2016, 02:53 AM
I haven't chimed in on this one in awhile, I`ll have to admit it looks great, keep it up FE. Carkshark, you`re absolutely correct, there is an uncanny resemblance there.. they must be related.. :D

Fly_electric
01-12-2016, 06:25 AM
Thanks guys.
Resemblance? 1000% chance!

Question:
Is is possible to enable/disable the LEDs on the props? Seems I came across that once... I realize the LED rings are there to be an aid in night flying, but that is not real world, and with a white/light color on the plane, it is visible enough in the moonlight.

Few very short videos of the lights as of now. Rename the extension to mp4 to view.

Fly_electric
01-14-2016, 10:05 PM
Anyone have info if/how to enable/disable the LEDs on the props?

Thanks

csgill75
01-14-2016, 10:42 PM
Is there the option to disable the night flying glow in the settings menu?

I don't think that it's what your looking for though. In searching the forums I did come across this question was brought up a few years ago, the fix was "change the prop to one that doesn't glow". I've never found a way to disable it either.

Nowadays I guess you could make your own prop.

Fly_electric
01-26-2016, 03:02 AM
A little more progress.

Have the basic flight instruments in place. For the available IP area, the best results were obtained with shrinking down from an instrument cluster that is a 1300x1065 and 72 dpi file.

Had to repair the glow polygons for the flashing nav lights (were just detached from the wing, but when off in the daylight, the polygon is transparent, so a backing surface was required).

With that done, have now started in on the initial pass at the normals map for the elevator and rudder ribs.

Posting IS getting closer...

Fly_electric
01-26-2016, 03:05 AM
A few "after hours" views..

Could have bumped the cowl bolts, but glad I didn't-- looks much better when they create actual shadows across the cowl.

technoid
01-26-2016, 09:13 AM
Very nice... I like!

doug schluter
01-26-2016, 12:13 PM
thanks for the update FE excellent work on the SMB

12oclockhigh
01-26-2016, 01:41 PM
I like the night flying details...I wonder about the nose light... are you sure the opening is for a landing light. Seems a bit wierd... I would think leading edge lighting for landing..

I know you wanted to eliminate on the prop LEDs, but I think that it only makes the total model better.

On the fence about the pilot :) :) Plane looks great, it has really grown on me.

Fly_electric
01-26-2016, 07:53 PM
Thanks guys.

12oclockhigh:

The details being used as a CS guide was from a father/son rebuild effort of a Sig model. Both the real plane and the Sig kit just had an air take. I guess the son wanted to mod the cowl a bit and turn the intake into a light-- actually a very good job on that. As you are probably aware, landing/taxi lights in the cowl are not uncommon on small planes, so the son may not have been too far off as maybe some one who built one of the full size Bravo I or Bravo II kits may have made the same mod.

Brields95
01-26-2016, 09:08 PM
Looks very nice!

Ron6234
01-26-2016, 09:27 PM
looks great FE, I can't wait to see it on the swaps

Fly_electric
01-26-2016, 11:15 PM
Thanks guys.

Fly_electric
01-27-2016, 08:25 AM
Cowl drop feature: update

This is never worked on the SMB. RF is not detecting the ~CS_COWL object (even tried RF 6.5). After trying various things to find the problem, I finally tried:
renamed the cowl
created a new small object and named it ~CS_COWL

RF then finds it (and am assuming the drop feature will then also work). So, there is something that RF does not like about the existing cowl object after all its editing. Reminds a me a bit of the bug in the latest exporter that, for unknown editing changes of some earlier designs (retracts seemed to be the common thread), crashes 3ds max and corrupts the max file such that it cannot be opened.

So, for this repair I'll start with the cowl from the earliest auto backed file. Might get lucky there, but worst case is the cowl will have to be remade. Regardless, the new cowl will also have to be remapped.

Sorry for the delay.

Could leave the plane as is, but am guessing everyone wants to see the cowl drop feature work.

technoid
01-27-2016, 10:36 AM
Bummer... Do it the way that works best for you.

abaser
01-27-2016, 10:47 AM
When you say RF doesn't see it, is it just not listed as a component frame option, or it just doesn't drop?

doug schluter
01-27-2016, 11:05 AM
although the cowl drop would be a nice feature to view your engine details and to know whats causing the problem it's not a huge deal to not have it , imo

12oclockhigh
01-27-2016, 12:21 PM
Maybe our friend from Germany can tell us what is done to drop the cowl. It is more common on helis. I am wondering if the cowl is trapped if it not split into two pieces?

technoid
01-27-2016, 01:20 PM
Maybe our friend from Germany can tell us what is done to drop the cowl. It is more common on helis. I am wondering if the cowl is trapped if it not split into two pieces?

The planes I've created that had cowls that drop the cowl and fuselage was two different pieces. I imagine fly's is the same way, but if not yeah they need to be.

abaser
01-27-2016, 01:38 PM
Not necessarily. If I'm not mistaken, thegibson has a MX that drops a one piece cowl. I think my katana also drops a one piece, but I haven't messed with that one in so long I can't remember.

technoid
01-27-2016, 02:14 PM
Not necessarily. If I'm not mistaken, thegibson has a MX that drops a one piece cowl. I think my katana also drops a one piece, but I haven't messed with that one in so long I can't remember.

But is the fuselage and the cowl two different pieces?

abaser
01-27-2016, 03:17 PM
Yes. They are separate from each other, but they are each one piece.

technoid
01-27-2016, 07:48 PM
Yes. They are separate from each other, but they are each one piece.

That's what I thought, you taught me how to do it. I think all of the ones I created used a shell modifier and then converted back to edit poly, but of course that's still one piece.

Fly_electric
01-28-2016, 02:49 AM
Mystery solved (at least to some extent):

After some trial and error, discovered the cowl drop works-- when all the C-meshes are deleted...

With only a few C-meshes on the model, the next step will be to see if it is a particular one.
It was great news that the cowl did not have to be remade, or as I was thinking for awhile, corrupt physics (also no fun to have to make again).

humble pie dept:
The cowl not being recognized was because of a typo in the cowl part name:
~CS_ COWL is NOT the same as ~CS_COWL. With the font size in max and the way the C in COWL curves away from the underscore, it didn't LOOK like there was a space there.... :o

technoid
01-28-2016, 06:06 AM
Okay... Good news! Don't you just love finding little things like that, that bite you so hard. Oh yeah, been there many times. I worked all morning at Apple on Thanksgiving day only to have my whole mornings work destroyed when I hit the Reset key to start the program. I had set the Reset Vector to restart the program, a test program for the line, but when I hit the Reset key to restart the program the system restarted instead and deleted the program. Which I hadn't saved in about 4 hours, so I had to work all afternoon to recreate the program. So little things can bite really hard.

doug schluter
01-28-2016, 08:22 PM
yes that is good news , FE the engine exhaust and firewall look really good , nice to be able to show it off

Fly_electric
02-04-2016, 09:42 PM
Have the normals map added.
Moving on to the spec map.

A few recent pictures from one of the great APs.

Fly_electric
02-04-2016, 09:45 PM
Also discovered surfaces are not too solid. Magic smoke goes right through.. :)
Apparently smoke has no C-mesh??

Update:A little IrfanView help to correctly show the under the bridge picture.

doug schluter
02-04-2016, 11:19 PM
SMB sure is looking great FE

technoid
02-05-2016, 12:29 AM
Very slick, can't wait to fly it... super cool!

uncle twist
02-05-2016, 12:29 AM
For sure, one of your best efforts, FE. The detail really stands out. Very nice ;)

Fly_electric
02-05-2016, 08:25 AM
Thank guys.

Fly_electric
02-26-2016, 01:49 AM
Working on a few last minute touches..

Already ported over and ready for RF 6.5 users

Fly_electric
02-26-2016, 01:50 AM
A few more..

uncle twist
02-26-2016, 02:21 AM
Working on a few last minute touches..

Already ported over and ready for RF 6.5 users
RF6 users. :eek: That`s great news. I`m going to have to do some research for a CS now. Happy days are here again. :D Looks great FE, can`t wait.

technoid
02-26-2016, 05:00 AM
Okay I'm ready, she's looking fine!

Fly_electric
02-26-2016, 10:19 AM
Thanks guys.

Actually got quite a complement on the SMB last week. In my office at work, one of the PCs has the Win Media player usually running, showing various multi rotor flight videos or RF flights. One of the techs was in and a video of the SMB in same photorealistic AP just posted was playing. He thought it was a video of a real world model.

doug schluter
02-26-2016, 11:12 AM
sweet i'm ready too FE

Fly_electric
02-29-2016, 02:20 AM
The SMB has been posted:

http://www.knifeedge.com/forums/downloads.php?do=file&id=22381


Last addition was a minor change to the pilot lens.

Thanks to all who helped with this project!

doug schluter
02-29-2016, 03:21 AM
thanks for doing this build of the Sig Morrisey Bravo FE you sure put the time and effort into it and it shows

12oclockhigh
02-29-2016, 06:25 AM
Congrats... nice job, good addition to the hangar.

Fly_electric
02-29-2016, 08:26 AM
Thanks guys.

It was an honor Doug.

technoid
02-29-2016, 10:11 AM
This plane is extremely well done, thanks for doing such a great job... I just grabbed it.

Fly_electric
02-29-2016, 01:30 PM
Thanks technoid.

Ron6234
02-29-2016, 03:40 PM
How sweet it is, thanks FE for another great aircraft, you did a super job on this one, thanks again!
Ron

uncle twist
02-29-2016, 03:54 PM
Beautiful job FE, love the animated servos, especially the throttle linkage. great CS as well. Thanks again for the RF6 release. :D

Fly_electric
02-29-2016, 04:24 PM
Thanks guys.

Some may not know what this means, and have to Google it:
"How sweet it is": if I'd known you were going to say that, I'd have tried for Jackie Gleason as the pilot. :)

uncle twist
02-29-2016, 04:48 PM
Thanks guys.

Some may not know what this means, and have to Google it:
"How sweet it is": if I'd known you were going to say that, I'd have tried for Jackie Gleason as the pilot. :)
I don`t know FE, using him as a pilot may have put you over the poly limit. :eek:

doug schluter
03-01-2016, 06:54 PM
i did an AV of FE's excellent SMB to 125% scale of the original EA with the physics to match , just a bigger size for those that like the larger scale .

http://www.knifeedge.com/forums/downloads.php?do=file&id=22382

technoid
03-01-2016, 07:18 PM
i did an AV of FE's excellent SMB to 125% scale of the original EA with the physics to match , just a bigger size for those that like the larger scale .

http://www.knifeedge.com/forums/downloads.php?do=file&id=22382

Very cool I got the first download, spot on everywhere thanks for doing it I love the larger size.

Fly_electric
03-02-2016, 09:47 AM
Doug, legoman:
Nice work on the SMB AVs.

legoman
03-02-2016, 11:08 AM
Doug, legoman:
Nice work on the SMB AVs.

Thanks Fly_electric. I hope everyone else enjoys it as well

doug schluter
03-02-2016, 05:44 PM
thanks FE love this SMB i always wanted one ,

Fly_electric
03-03-2016, 01:37 PM
thanks FE love this SMB i always wanted one ,

You are most welcome my friend.

doug schluter
03-06-2016, 01:35 AM
heres the CS i did for your excellent Morrisey Bravo it turned out good , i like your CS better , not much for pics out there for the SMB as for color schemes .

http://www.knifeedge.com/forums/downloads.php?do=file&id=22391

technoid
03-06-2016, 02:43 AM
heres the CS i did for your excellent Morrisey Bravo it turned out good , i like your CS better , not much for pics out there for the SMB as for color schemes .

http://www.knifeedge.com/forums/downloads.php?do=file&id=22391

I just grabbed your CS, very nice thanks!

Fly_electric
03-06-2016, 10:39 PM
Well done Doug! Like the black "step" area-- nice touch!

Here are a few "non traditional" paint jobs that I have seen.

U-Bird
03-08-2016, 11:12 AM
The full size plane was a homebuilt. It was to be built by people who would build them in their garage, workshop or a warehouse. They would paint them as they liked and there would be no "standard" color scheme other than the builders imaginations.
On my own models, scale fidelity is only adhered to for models to be contested, otherwise I paint to suite myself. See the Morrisey I posted last nite. A CS just to please and that's all.
Seem like there were not many Bravo's built full size. Nice plane Fly_electric, thanks!!!!

technoid
03-08-2016, 01:40 PM
The full size plane was a homebuilt. It was to be built by people who would build them in their garage, workshop or a warehouse. They would paint them as they liked and there would be no "standard" color scheme other than the builders imaginations.
On my own models, scale fidelity is only adhered to for models to be contested, otherwise I paint to suite myself. See the Morrisey I posted last nite. A CS just to please and that's all.
Seem like there were not many Bravo's built full size. Nice plane Fly_electric, thanks!!!!

Very nice I like it a lot.. Great Work! ( just grabbed it )

U-Bird
03-08-2016, 03:15 PM
FE has a winner in his Morrisey and it flies very well. I'm glad you enjoy the CS, thanks for the comp. The Sig model was a very good flying model, hardly ever see one today.

Fly_electric
03-09-2016, 08:22 AM
Very nice CS U-bird!

The AP shown in your post is a modified Joe's Garage. Is that a personal mod or one that has been posted??

U-Bird
03-09-2016, 06:47 PM
You right about the AP, just stuck the plane in there for the posing shots. I do, however make AP's of my own, however, being a scale guy, I don't post them as seems most want all kind of floating stuff in the sky.
Here's 2 shots of one of my own. Yes the shots are the same AP. Over the years I have made quite a few APs and most require a better than Walmart computer. I do a lot more than just CS and run RF on this thing. Again, thanks for the nice bird:)

uncle twist
03-11-2016, 10:05 PM
Got some spare time as of late, so I thought I might do a CS for FE`s Bravo. I`m just winging it here, :p, not based on any CS I`ve seen on a Bravo, just what I thought might look nice. Don`t pay any attention to the orange line on the upper / forward, fuse (it`s just a test line). Still trying to figure out what to do with the wings and H/V stabs :rolleyes:

Fly_electric
03-15-2016, 10:25 AM
It's looking good UT.