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  #1  
Old 06-11-2006, 05:24 AM
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inky00 inky00 is offline
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Auto Gyro

Here is the Auto Gyro.
The throttle for the engine is on the rotory knob and up and down on the left stick controls the collective on the rotor.
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File Type: jpg ScreenShot1149965107.jpg (123.1 KB, 80 views)
File Type: jpg ScreenShot1149931018.jpg (81.4 KB, 68 views)
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File Type: g3x AutoGyro_EA.G3X (692.6 KB, 581 views)
  #2  
Old 06-11-2006, 08:08 AM
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sweet!
  #3  
Old 06-11-2006, 11:26 AM
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Thank you for this inky00!!!
  #4  
Old 06-11-2006, 11:53 AM
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FLY NAVY
  #5  
Old 06-11-2006, 01:43 PM
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Thumbs up

WOW!!! didn't think that was suppose to be able to be made for G3. But that's Awesome! didn't think they'd be that tough to fly thought..

Good Work
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  #6  
Old 06-11-2006, 02:40 PM
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Excellent! Most excellent! Reminds me of a yellow "flying banana" I used to scooter-poop around in...same basic config, except no collective, as autogyros rotor blades free-wheel in flight. Some have pre-rotators to shorten take-off roll, however.

I'd like to see a Bensen style autogyro (rotor is freewheeling, like a pinwheel, no variable/collective pitch) modeled for G3.

Charles
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Last edited by r1derbike; 06-11-2006 at 02:42 PM.
  #7  
Old 06-11-2006, 02:57 PM
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Coupla' things, Inky:

The rudder deflection is correct, but the aircraft turns the opposite direction; left rudder give right turns, right rudder gives left turns, while on the ground. In the air, the rudder behaves somewhat normally.

I'd prefer throttle on the left stick, and no collective pitch (other than several degrees, built-in) on the main rotor. Some hotshots had ground adjustable hub-bars that could be adjusted many degrees, to fine tune the overall pitch of their blades. I had some helicopter blades with a "twist" built-in, and had to run them upside down in the gimbal, to achieve the required overall pitch for a freewheeling rotor. While certainly novel (one may come-in hot, crank-in some collective, and hover for a bit before touch-down) it is not common on autogyros.

Some "pinheads" (no pun intended) had a zero to several degrees adjustable hub that was not flight variable, and instantly snapped preset collective (could not be returned to zero in the air), the purpose being they could spin-up the blades at zero with a prerotator, disengage it, hit the release and actually "jump" into the air with little forward roll. The blades would stay at the preset collective during the flight, of course, and could only be reset on the ground. If you've ever seen the (Hiller, Hillman, who knows?) autogyro, it used this to jaw-dropping perfection.

With no pre-rotator, Bensen autogyros must be taxiied with full-up (stick toward pilot) until the blades come-up to near flying speed. This after locking the nosewheel brake and using prop blast to spin-them-up a bit (they have to be patted-up manually by the pilot, prior to the taxi and rollout...human or armstrong prerotator, we call it). Then, you make your takeoff roll with stick still back, until the gyro rocks backward. You have to do a balancing act at this time, by pushing forward on the stick to reduce drag and commence the takeoff roll, balancing on the main gear and using the rudder to steer now, not the castoring nosewheel assembly with foot controls, as it is off the ground (the nosewheel brake, nothing more than a piece of wood you pressed on the tire was connected to the rudder pedals with springs, but was better used on the ground for steering with a "foot bar" across the brake. Continuing this attitude will see you gently takeoff, or you may impress the masses with "up" stick, for a better climbout, WFO. 45 degrees climbout was not uncommon, given our hot-rodded VW motors, and long blades (extended hub-bar).

The above procedure is for Bensen style gyrocopters, or at least my two, which were highly modified variants of it.

I doubt this would be possible with G3, but would be very realistic, as this is how autogyros fly. After touchdown (with no rotor blade brake), the pilot had to stop the aircraft, unbuckle and then the blades had to be "patted-down" as well, to get them stopped quickly...otherwise, a bit of flapping and theatrics would ensue at various stages of the rotor spin-down, besides taking a very long time before the aircraft was safe to be approached, or left alone. This was a must with the Bensen Gyrocopters, as the mast length ground-to-gimbal was so short.

Autogyros without a prerotator/brake, are a real pain-in-the-ass, but fun.

Just think of them as a pinwheel that is pushed or pulled through the air with a gimbal controlling the position of the pinwheel; that pretty much describes how they fly. The airframe acts like a powered pendulum, getting dragged around by the attitude of the rotor blades.

Charles
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Last edited by r1derbike; 06-12-2006 at 11:22 AM.
  #8  
Old 06-11-2006, 08:09 PM
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Unhappy Challenge!

First bird on this forum that I've not been able to fly successfully ... seems to kill the engine immediately after lift-off, so my HOTAS skills are clearly deficient. any recommendations on procedures, above and beyond those already cited? You guys are AMAZING! NOTHING seems impossible from what I've seen over the last couple of days since I chimed in. Keep 'em coming guys, until I learn how to add some of my own aircraft to the mix.
Bob
  #9  
Old 06-11-2006, 08:23 PM
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The rudder performs somewhat normally after airborne. I've found that the oddball flight setup requires that you use the 3D airports (not the photofields) and fly chase, until you get accustomed to just how much collective (left stick), throttle, and attitude inputs to use.

I'd try to set it up correctly, but don't know anything about how to do that. All I know is how to fly autogyros, and how they are setup in the real world. Maybe some modeling gurus on this site may tackle it?

Thanks for all your efforts, inky!

Charles
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  #10  
Old 06-11-2006, 08:50 PM
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when i start getting in the air, the engine dies out on me? any one know wat the problem is?



BTW: love it
  #11  
Old 06-11-2006, 11:08 PM
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I had lots of difficulty until I did the same thing riderbike did: chase it in 3D. I also found that using full throttle to take off will torque roll it into the ground every time. I use about 60% throttle and get it rolling. Easy on the forward collective to get airborne. Too aggressive and you kill the motor and rotor and down you go.

I can take off while flying in r/c mode but I had to use a modified 3D airport (Joes) with all the buildings and stuff removed so I can have a nice long rollout and then I can fly it around me okay. Another method is to get it going in Chase mode, and then when you have stable flight established switch back to Fixed Position (r/c) mode.
  #12  
Old 06-12-2006, 10:24 AM
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It needs a bunch of changes to the physics to fly right due to the way G3 is trying to deal with it.

I've already been able to prevent the right roll at takeoff, etc. but there are a lot of things to work out.

I may not be able to get to this for a few weeks as I'm due to be away.
  #13  
Old 06-12-2006, 11:12 AM
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Thanks, op! I know you may groom it to excellence!
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  #14  
Old 06-12-2006, 01:48 PM
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It might help if the rotor system was completely hooked up and completed. Right now it is hard to tell how fast the rotor system is turning just by looking at the blades. You should be able to copy the basic heirarchy from the sample helicopters.

From what I see, you are missing the following frames...
  1. ~CS_MH_3BLADE_LEADLAG1
  2. ~CS_MH_3BLADE_LEADLAG2
  3. ~CS_MH_3BLADE_LEADLAG3
  4. ~CS_MH_3BLADE_FLAP1
  5. ~CS_MH_3BLADE_FLAP2
  6. ~CS_MH_3BLADE_FLAP3
  #15  
Old 06-12-2006, 04:57 PM
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I did notice that the blades seem to suffer the dreaded "strobe" effect as they appear to speed-up and slow down, appearing to stop at times, as if an invisible strobe light is pulsing on them.

Looks like Vitek already has a handle on that!

Also, I don't know if it would help flight modeling, but once airborne, an autogyro is flown like a conventional fixed-wing aircraft. Stick movements are the same, as there is no mainrotor torque (and no tailrotor is needed) on the airframe.

It may be easier to set it up to fly like an airplane, and just have a visual flight model of the autogyro and rotating blades...is this possible?

Charles
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Last edited by r1derbike; 06-12-2006 at 05:11 PM.
 

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