RealFlight 8 VR Tips

VRDaddy

New member
Ya, hopefully they can help. It could be an issue with your amd fx 9750 processor. Maybe it does not play as well as my i7 7700hq with rf8. In non-vr mode I get ~500fps on the 3d obstacle field. Much higher fps than you seem to get.
I was going to upgrade to a ryzen 1800x, but after have no issues with any vr content (other than RF8) I decided to hold off.

The last thing i am going to try is setting everything to the lowest possible setting just to see if i can get RF8 to get above 45fps.
 

VRDaddy

New member
So I did some more testing.

With SS @ .6, RF8 @ low and RF8 VR @ low I can manage between 60-90 fps. My cpu usage is @ 35%, GPU at 30% and memory @ 32%.

With SS @ 1.5, RF8 @ highest and RF8 VR @ highest I get 30-45 fps. My cpu usage is @39%, GPU @ 43% and memory @35%.

Not sure what to make of this. The bottom line for me is that even at the absolute lowest settings RF8 is still unusable for me. I guess all I can hope for is that Knife Edge finds a way to optimize RF8

Maybe my cpu is the bottleneck. It's the only thing that makes sense.

If I do an upgrade I will make sure to post and let everyone know if it made a difference. :)
 

csgill75

Well-known member
RF-8 uses one core/thread on the processor. The older AMD processors are not well suited for this application. Using a newer Ryzen or Intel CPU will improve your frame rates. You will notice a huge improvement in system performance with a newer CPU. I went from a phenom x6 1100t to the I7 6700k and it was unbelievable. The 1100t was a great CPU running everything that I threw at it, but the 6700k more than doubled my performance. I now have a 7700k since the 6700k was killed by a lightning strike on my satellite dish.

RF-X can utilize all threads on the CPU however it has been seen to reduce performance in certain setups. It comes default as a single thread application, but can be re-enabled
 

VRDaddy

New member
RF-8 uses one core/thread on the processor. The older AMD processors are not well suited for this application. Using a newer Ryzen or Intel CPU will improve your frame rates. You will notice a huge improvement in system performance with a newer CPU. I went from a phenom x6 1100t to the I7 6700k and it was unbelievable. The 1100t was a great CPU running everything that I threw at it, but the 6700k more than doubled my performance. I now have a 7700k since the 6700k was killed by a lightning strike on my satellite dish.

RF-X can utilize all threads on the CPU however it has been seen to reduce performance in certain setups. It comes default as a single thread application, but can be re-enabled
Thanks for the info! You are probably correct. My cpu is killing me. I am looking at an i7 8700k. I think that should do the trick! lol.
 

Bill Stuntz

Member
RF-X can utilize all threads on the CPU however it has been seen to reduce performance in certain setups. It comes default as a single thread application, but can be re-enabled
How? I don't recall seeing this mentioned anywhere. How can I determine whether MY setup would speed up or slow down in multithread mode?

If it's only "certain" setups, why handicap the rest of us? That doesn't make sense to me unless it slows "most" setups, and only a few setups work properly.
 

csgill75

Well-known member
How? I don't recall seeing this mentioned anywhere. How can I determine whether MY setup would speed up or slow down in multithread mode?

If it's only "certain" setups, why handicap the rest of us? That doesn't make sense to me unless it slows "most" setups, and only a few setups work properly.
It's enabled in the console. RF-X shipped with all the cores enabled and with most setups it degraded performance. With the first update we received it disabled multi thread. Anything but the higher end systems had reduced performance. There is a console command that enables/disables this feature. I don't recall what it is as I just use it the way it comes but I'll look it up as it's In the same thread about the judder and studder work arounds.

Edit: I found the information your looking for


To disable physics multithreading, enter the console command "physics_threaded 0". Then fly around like normal and observe any changes. If you were actually experiencing what we call hitching, then hopefully you will see a noticeable improvement.

To go back to the previous (default) behavior, enter "physics_threaded 2" in the console. Note that simply exiting and restarting the sim will not reset this value to its default. If you adjust it, you will need to
 
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Bill Stuntz

Member
Thanks. But it appears that it only applies to RF-X, which I don't have any more. In RF-8 it isn't a valid command. In RF-8, it appears that all 8 cores in my Xeon e5-1620 3.6GHz are active.

I'm thinking about buying RF-X again now that I have a better video card - GTX-760, but I haven't done it yet. I keep hemming & hawing about it. I'm going back & forth between trying RF-X again or trying a VR headset for RF-8. I'm afraid my GTX-760 might not be able to handle either one adequately. I now have access to a recycled Radeon HD7980, but I don't know whether it would make it either - benchmarks are only about 10% faster than my 760. Another option might be to go to a different recycled PC with an i7-4770 instead of the Xeon because it's supposed to be faster for gaming, but I'm pretty satisfied with RF-8 on the system I have now. Both machines are HP workstation-class PC's. RF's really the only "gaming" I do.

Do you have any recommendations about which option(s) would be "best"?
 

csgill75

Well-known member
Thanks. But it appears that it only applies to RF-X, which I don't have any more. In RF-8 it isn't a valid command. In RF-8, it appears that all 8 cores in my Xeon e5-1620 3.6GHz are active.

I'm thinking about buying RF-X again now that I have a better video card - GTX-760, but I haven't done it yet. I keep hemming & hawing about it. I'm going back & forth between trying RF-X again or trying a VR headset for RF-8. I'm afraid my GTX-760 might not be able to handle either one adequately. I now have access to a recycled Radeon HD7980, but I don't know whether it would make it either - benchmarks are only about 10% faster than my 760. Another option might be to go to a different recycled PC with an i7-4770 instead of the Xeon because it's supposed to be faster for gaming, but I'm pretty satisfied with RF-8 on the system I have now. Both machines are HP workstation-class PC's. RF's really the only "gaming" I do.

Do you have any recommendations about which option(s) would be "best"?

Yes, it is a RF-X only command.

I would go for the fastest available GPU you can get your hands on. As far as the I7-4770, It would be a faster all around CPU and you would notice a Frame Rate increase even with your current GPU. I would definitely update to the newer CPU. Here is a comparison of the two so you can see the difference.

http://cpuboss.com/cpus/Intel-Xeon-E5-1620-vs-Intel-Core-i7-4770K
 

Bill Stuntz

Member
The machine I have now is an HP Z420 Xeon. The replacement I have available is a Z220. The CPU isn't the K version. But the CPU rating isn't much different - 8.2vs8.3. Both machines use the same PC3-14900 ECC RAM. I've been trying to decide whether it's worth the hassle of reinstalling everything on a new machine. If I'm lucky, I might be able to move my existing boot SSD & RAID array into the new machine, but I'm not SURE it will boot with the different chipset. If it boots, I'm sure I'll have to update the chipset drivers and re-activate Win10, but I can handle that easily.
 

TomC

Member
Thanks for the info! You are probably correct. My cpu is killing me. I am looking at an i7 8700k. I think that should do the trick! lol.
Another thing that may help your framerates is to uninstall the NVidia 3d vision and geoforce experience programs (you should reboot after doing this). These seems to drag down all Windows mixed reality performance (esp. the 3d vision one) right now for all wmr headsets, but esp. the Samsung. The 3d vision program/feature is only needed if you are using 3d shutter glasses (like some 3d TV's use). I doubt that many actually use these anymore, esp. since the VR era.

When I update my NVidia drivers I always select the custom install and un-check 3d vision drivers and geoforce experience. Neither of these add any value to wmr right now imho.

Also, you really need to try new settings one at a time to see the effect. For example, I actually found that I got better FPS using SS = 0.9 than I did on 0.8 or below, or 1.0 and above. Not sure why but it might have something to do with the way SteamVR scales to your headset resolution. Since your Samsung headset is slightly higher resolution you may find 0.8 works best, but who knows. I also found that the last 2 bottom items on the RF8 quality pane worked best if they were both set to highest. RF VR quality set to high also seems to work best for me.

Lastly, there are so many NVidia control panel 3d settings that you can select that it can get a bit confusing at times. I have played with all of them and never found a best case for RF8-VR. I've actually found the best results by simply going to the NVidia's control panel and using the top option to adjust settings with preference. then select the 3rd one down and move the slider to the middle = Preferred emphasis = Balanced. I'm not sure why but this has improved all my wmr vr apps, including RF8. Surprisingly this has not had any significant effect on any of my non-vr games/apps performance/fps (like even RF8 in non-vr mode). If you do this you should do a reboot. Worth a try, and nothing to lose imho.

Edit; the Very last thing I would add is to play with your wmr headset settings (auto-low-med-high-highest beta). In my case I have found that selecting high helps improve my wmr and Steam apps. If you change these settings you must exit out of wmr and restat wmr btw.
 
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VRDaddy

New member
Another thing that may help your framerates is to uninstall the NVidia 3d vision and geoforce experience programs (you should reboot after doing this). These seems to drag down all Windows mixed reality performance (esp. the 3d vision one) right now for all wmr headsets, but esp. the Samsung. The 3d vision program/feature is only needed if you are using 3d shutter glasses (like some 3d TV's use). I doubt that many actually use these anymore, esp. since the VR era.

When I update my NVidia drivers I always select the custom install and un-check 3d vision drivers and geoforce experience. Neither of these add any value to wmr right now imho.

Also, you really need to try new settings one at a time to see the effect. For example, I actually found that I got better FPS using SS = 0.9 than I did on 0.8 or below, or 1.0 and above. Not sure why but it might have something to do with the way SteamVR scales to your headset resolution. Since your Samsung headset is slightly higher resolution you may find 0.8 works best, but who knows. I also found that the last 2 bottom items on the RF8 quality pane worked best if they were both set to highest. RF VR quality set to high also seems to work best for me.

Lastly, there are so many NVidia control panel 3d settings that you can select that it can get a bit confusing at times. I have played with all of them and never found a best case for RF8-VR. I've actually found the best results by simply going to the NVidia's control panel and using the top option to adjust settings with preference. then select the 3rd one down and move the slider to the middle = Preferred emphasis = Balanced. I'm not sure why but this has improved all my wmr vr apps, including RF8. Surprisingly this has not had any significant effect on any of my non-vr games/apps performance/fps (like even RF8 in non-vr mode). If you do this you should do a reboot. Worth a try, and nothing to lose imho.

Edit; the Very last thing I would add is to play with your wmr headset settings (auto-low-med-high-highest beta). In my case I have found that selecting high helps improve my wmr and Steam apps. If you change these settings you must exit out of wmr and restat wmr btw.
Hi Tom,

So I did some more digging and found the SteamVR frame timing utility. That told me everything I needed to know. My cpu is getting destroyed with a capital DESTROYED! I was able to do real time testing with RealFlight 8 running in VR and standard mode. In standard mode on high settings my pc was barely breaking a sweat. In VR mode my cpu came crashing down to its knees begging for mercy! lol.

Soooooooooo.........................time to upgrade cpu, mb and mem. Everything else is good to go.
 

TomC

Member
If you have not already done so, try the Nvidia balanced mode and rerun those tests.

Everything is interrelated.
 

VRDaddy

New member
Sooooooo..........................I ordered an i5 8600k, MSI Z370 Gaming Pro Carbon motherboard, 16gb (8x2) G. Skill Trident Z RGB 3000mhz memory and Thermaltake View 31 TR RGB case (for far better cooling than my current old Cooler Master case and it just looks awesome, lol). The new gear will get paired with my Gigabyte OC'd 1060 6gb gpu, high quality 610W power supply, 2 ssd's (one for OS and one for storage) and Corsair H60 cpu liquid cooler.

I will post back once I get this built and am able to do some testing. I have a feeling I will be able to hit 90fps with some decent settings with this new setup.

Thanks again for everyone who was trying to help me!!

Mike
 

VRDaddy

New member
i5???
Why bother.
I actually ended up ordering the i7 8700k. I was going to state the change when I gave an update on how the new system performed.

I kept going back and fourth on which one to buy and decided to change to the 8700k at the last minute. I actually canceled the 8600k order and got the 8700k.
 

12oclockhigh

Well-known member
I know you are trying to contain cost. I would have at least gone with the 1080 (not ti). This is going to be your bottle neck now. It sure costs a lot of money to play.
 

VRDaddy

New member
I know you are trying to contain cost. I would have at least gone with the 1080 (not ti). This is going to be your bottle neck now. It sure costs a lot of money to play.
I have been in IT as a career my entire adult life (25 years), so I am well versed in the cost of "playing" with tech; especially first gen tech. :)

For me it is more about spending wisely then it is about cost. My gpu is about a month old and I was going to go with the 1080Ti, but I am not going to pay the insane inflated price that gpu's are at right now. Memory prices are bad enough. I was very lucky to find my Gigabyte Windofrce 1060 6gb OC for 325.00. They lasted about 2 hours before they went out of stock again. lol.

For my purposes, at the moment, it will do just fine. Hopefully in the next year or so gpu prices will settle down and I will pick up a bigger gpu.

As far as RealFlight 8 goes, I am sure the cpu,mb,mem upgrade will solve my issues. According to the SteamVR real time frame timing graphs my gpu is barely breaking a sweat and my cpu is completely done. Almost the entire cpu graph is red and you can see it causing massive reprojections in the gpu graph.

Time will tell. Should have it done this weekend and I will post back with the results.
 

VRDaddy

New member
Hi everyone,

I am happy to report I am locked in at 90 fps on the highest settings with a SteamVR SS of 2.0!!

The upgrade made all the difference!

Thank you everyone for the help!!
 

TomC

Member
Hi everyone,

I am happy to report I am locked in at 90 fps on the highest settings with a SteamVR SS of 2.0!!

The upgrade made all the difference!

Thank you everyone for the help!!
Great news, I'm soooo jealous! You probably have enough horsepower to give RF-X VR a go.
 
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